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+----- Thread: Avoca male lions (/topic-avoca-male-lions)
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RE: Avoca male lions - Ttimemarti - 04-23-2023
(04-23-2023, 01:36 AM)Duco Ndona Wrote: There is a vague picking order. But its not well defined but more blurry. The strongest lion may be more charitable and easier to steal food from than a weaker member in a bad mood and so on.
Its definitely not like the biggest stronger lion eats first and then the second strongest etc that you sometimes see in movies.
Even in decision making its more decentralised. One lioness stands up and begins stretching etc to go for a hunt. The rest just looks at her and decide for themselves if they want to go aswell.. Some may get up as well and if enough lions do that They all go.
But if enough lions keep laying down. The original lioness that stood up lies down as well.
Offcource there is some natural order in things. Like some lions being more followers than others. But definitely not an alpha thing or something like that. If they feel like it they have no issue following the weakest for a bit.
True but isn’t it when the entire pride hunts the oldest most experienced female leads the hunt would that make her the leader of the pride and in the males too makhulu nduna amahle Skorro jr lead their brothers the most dominant they mate the most more food etc. and females like k6
RE: Avoca male lions - Duco Ndona - 04-23-2023
Nope. Its all just pretty much just up to what the lions feel like doing. Not on who is the oldest or strongest.
That you can beat the others if it comes to food and mating does not mean you decide what to do next.
RE: Avoca male lions - Mapokser - 04-23-2023
@Potato I wasn't saying a bigger mane makes a stronger lion, but we know manes are very important for intimidation as it makes them look bigger and dominant/fully developed, many dominant males chase youngsters because the young males get intimidated by the more developed mane of their enemy.
But the sub wasn't intimidated by his father at all which was my point.
RE: Avoca male lions - Potato - 04-23-2023
(04-23-2023, 05:57 AM)Mapokser Wrote: but we know manes are very important for intimidationA statement I highly disagree with.
RE: Avoca male lions - Tr1x24 - 04-23-2023
(04-23-2023, 05:57 AM)Mapokser Wrote: @Potato I wasn't saying a bigger mane makes a stronger lion, but we know manes are very important for intimidation as it makes them look bigger and dominant/fully developed, many dominant males chase youngsters because the young males get intimidated by the more developed mane of their enemy.
This is only "theory/speculation" , no way to prove this.
In fact, true,real purpose of mane is still not known for sure.
RE: Avoca male lions - Horizon - 04-23-2023
You can see most times Hyenas run right away after seeing a lion with full mane.
But among lions, mane doesn’t seem to have a decisive impact if the attackers are confident. Bob Jr, had a headful of mane, likewise Salas male. Same with Mr.T and Matshapiri males. Their attackers were almost maneless (they had little tufts of hair on their heads), but they simply ignored the looks and proceeded on to attack. Not sure if mane is a factor in lion warfares but surely it’s not decisive.
RE: Avoca male lions - T_Ferguson - 04-23-2023
Kevin Richardson did a couple of segments on this on his youtube channel. I think there is a theory that the mane is meant to deter other lions from biting at the throat. I am still at full amateur stage here for sure, but I do notice that most lions go at an animals back and then always end up going to the throat for the kill. Most male lion fights I've seen even ones like where the fight was 3 and 4 on 1, it seems that the lions are trying to break the spine to kill their opponent, and often, that's what is the kill shot. However, when male lions kill females, or cubs, they go for the neck. Maybe? I don't know. It's just one theory, and they are probably all wrong.
Ultimately, I think the mane now speaks more to the health of a lion rather than any sort of power or maleness.
RE: Avoca male lions - Duco Ndona - 04-23-2023
Its just one of the many factors lions look for. Not the big singular decisive one.
If a hells angel wears one. It looks scary as hell and I would be less inclined to pick a fight with him.
If Pee Wee Herman or Urkel starts sporting one... It just makes me laugh.
Its probably roughly similar to lions.
RE: Avoca male lions - Horizon - 04-23-2023
(04-23-2023, 06:18 PM)T_Ferguson Wrote: However, when male lions kill females, or cubs, they go for the neck.
Sometimes they go for throat of another male. It’s thought one of the Mjejane males killed the 5th Vurhami with a throat bite. (At that time, the poor chap was with an injury and a limp, had less mane. But surely he had some mane around his neck, not much though)
RE: Avoca male lions - T_Ferguson - 04-23-2023
(04-23-2023, 06:51 PM)Horizon Wrote:(04-23-2023, 06:18 PM)T_Ferguson Wrote: However, when male lions kill females, or cubs, they go for the neck.
Sometimes they go for throat of another male. It’s thought one of the Mjejane males killed the 5th Vurhami with a throat bite. (At that time, the poor chap was with an injury and a limp, had less mane. But surely he had some mane around his neck, not much though)
I mean.. .nothing is iron clad. It's all conjecture. I am making this up, and from what I read so are the experts. haha
RE: Avoca male lions - Mapokser - 04-23-2023
I do think the mane has potentially many roles, including a defensive one, but what is clear to me is that it makes them look bigger and helps with intimidation and is a reason for why youngsters ran even when outnumbering their opponent. The hyena example mentioned is also a good one.
Obviously intimidation won't always work regardless of mana but it is influenced by mane a lot I think. I even thought Kambulas would have attacked NK male if he had a full mane, but anyway.
RE: Avoca male lions - BigLion39 - 04-24-2023
There are many theories on lions mane but 1 thing is clear, nobody knows for sure. I don't think lionesses care if a male has a big black mane or not and I'm not sure if it shows any intimidation factor to other lions as we have clearly seen small mane lions kill, beat, and intimidate other lions with huge manes. Same with lionesses as they choose blonde mane lions and small mane lions. Im not sure any man will be able to figure out why?
RE: Avoca male lions - Mwk85 - 04-24-2023
(04-24-2023, 10:38 AM)BigLion39 Wrote: There are many theories on lions mane but 1 thing is clear, nobody knows for sure. I don't think lionesses care if a male has a big black mane or not and I'm not sure if it shows any intimidation factor to other lions as we have clearly seen small mane lions kill, beat, and intimidate other lions with huge manes. Same with lionesses as they choose blonde mane lions and small mane lions. Im not sure any man will be able to figure out why?
I remember watching a documentary that was done years ago testing the theory as to whether or not the color of a male lion's mane had an effect on female lions. They had two decoy (fake) male lion bodies, one with a lighter golden mane and the other with a darker nearly black mane, and the lionesses that responded to recorded male lion roars showed far more interest in the darker maned one. Obviously it was a small study, but it could lend credence to female lions having a preference when it comes to the color/darkness of a male lions mane.
RE: Avoca male lions - T_Ferguson - 04-24-2023
Well, this would be interesting. I'd love to know more about this 6 male encounter. I've been waiting to see where the Dreadlocks DeLaparte kids were going to go. If it was them.
RE: Avoca male lions - Horizon - 04-24-2023
Wow! This could turn into a big problem for S Avocas.