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+----- Thread: Lion Predation (/topic-lion-predation)
RE: Lion Predation - faess - 01-17-2015
And this is why, despite a huge weight disadvantage, a bear or wild boar will be a bigger problem than a buffalo in terms of predations for big cats. There is no uniqueness of killing a huge bovine when single smaller predators have done the same.
RE: Lion Predation - Pantherinae - 01-17-2015
'faess dateline='' Wrote: And this is why, despite a huge weight disadvantage, a bear or wild boar will be a bigger problem than a buffalo in terms of predations for big cats. There is no uniqueness of killing a huge bovine when single smaller predators have done the same.Are You actually saying a wild boar is more formidable than a gaur, cape buffalo or water buffalo? I think you're wrong, with all due respect to wild boars which is a formidable apponent, a bovine is just pure force and The veapons are just to dangerous.
It depends on The bear. I small ones are easy prey, but bigger bears would not be a smart thing to challenge, because a big male bear would beat up and destroy every male lion/tiger,
RE: Lion Predation - chaos - 01-17-2015
Wild boar have a nasty disposition and are a quite formidable opponent. Now are they more dangerous than
much larger and equally equipped buffalo or gaur? That I don't know about
RE: Lion Predation - Siegfried - 01-17-2015
(01-17-2015, 04:45 PM)'Pantherinae' Wrote:'faess dateline='' Wrote: And this is why, despite a huge weight disadvantage, a bear or wild boar will be a bigger problem than a buffalo in terms of predations for big cats. There is no uniqueness of killing a huge bovine when single smaller predators have done the same.
It depends on The bear. I small ones are easy prey, but bigger bears would not be a smart thing to challenge, because a big male bear would beat up and destroy every male lion/tiger,
I am not saying that a bear makes for an easy meal, but a big cat (lion or tiger sized) being the ultimate AMBUSH predator might catch one off guard... apply a throat hold and take one out. The key is the element of surprise. Hunting a bear is VERY different than fighting a bear.
RE: Lion Predation - Pckts - 01-18-2015
(01-16-2015, 07:53 PM)'Amnon242' Wrote:No evidence to back this claim.(01-16-2015, 03:36 AM)'Pantherinae' Wrote: Haha people calm down, this was a discussion about if a male lion can bring down a buffalo bull or not. Not if they can weigh 800 or 900 kg. never the less cape buffalos are massive animals with an aggression not matched by no other wild bovines, and a animal which every carnivore it shares habitats with respects.
I don't think a tiger would have a better chance against a cape buffalo bull to be honest. I've seen lone Lions take down buffalos bigger than the gaur Raja takes down with the same ease. And aswell has I've seen tigers have big respect for gaur's, even though The will take them down. I can agree with pckts on that tigers are a better hunter than male Lions, but only on some aspects. I think they're both in The same leauge when it comes to hunting buffalo, less stalking, just pure power.
I think tigers are better INDIVIDUAL hunters in every aspect except one - lions are better runners at longer distances.
Same league? Yes, I think so.
...and ofc lions are better team hunters.
Males will most definitely overheat as well, hence why they participate far less. There are accounts of tiger predations going on all night, their stamina is every bit as much as a lion.
RE: Lion Predation - Pckts - 01-18-2015
(01-17-2015, 12:57 AM)'chaos' Wrote: Its silly to assume a male lion has never killed a bull buffalo. In most vids of lions killing buffalo,
the victims gender is not visible. There are quite a few vids of single lions (and lionesses) taking
full grown buffalo. To say conclusively none were male when genetalia wasn't visible is simply
difficult to believe. Anyhow, the matter is inconsequential. Pockets can claim what he wants.
There has never been a report from a eye witness or image or video of any predation ever occuring between a lone male lion and a lone bull buffalo. Even the one where its a cow (no testicles) still has 3 plus lions involved so its not a lone lion either way.
RE: Lion Predation - Pckts - 01-18-2015
Quote:So a lion with buffalo carcass is now a kill?
Young male lion kills buffalo, looks as if a bull, by looking at horns.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YiqbCERag8
So the myth it takes a group of lions to kill a buffalo is not true, if one lion attacks alone, others will follow, however when the lion is alone, it can do it by itself. Bulls are taken too, I'm sure.
[img]images/smilies/smile.gif[/img]
No way you can even tell the sex of the buffalo, the buffalo is already dead, and their is never a seen of how it died. Could of died of old age, injury, other pride, hyennas etc. Pretty irresponsible to claim it as a Lion kill on a bull.
Just sayen
RE: Lion Predation - Pckts - 01-18-2015
(01-17-2015, 11:00 AM)'TheLioness' Wrote: Single lioness takes down bull and or two do, not sure, there is another photo in comments, she could have had it down when the other lion came in??
https://www.flickr.com/photos/eliasc64/8471469258/in/photolist-bgmNor-2z9UvR-9gqdnm-nYdaVN-5reS4B-5qhDBC-pimGd2-5r9TkD-64BEYg-amHbBt-dUAuEN-9f9smZ-ikRQsN-5sJT2N-9JDc9i-qf7CBV-qcQmmd-qcQmqS-pXGwZ8-dwd7B5-qhyCYW-9YAzG3-ahMVsZ-qo2e83-anHVGu-piYz6q-ebjmKC-q3pK1B-q3gFCy-pXvFTK-pYoXzm-qdFrou-pYpJPS-pYxJUT-pYoXPj-dUcozK-dw7yLT-qjPxYF-q3pJFi-q3pJAZ-qfUnef-pXxuN3-pi8m7h-pjcLP8-pXoyMf-pZ47kF-q3g6JQ-pXypkQ-pXGhUz-qfUhgQ/
*This image is copyright of its original author
Great videoshowing how strong a lioness is, single take down.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBLf9yv7mPg
I'll find more some other time, i think if a lioness can kill a cow alone and a young male can take down a bull, i dont see why a full grown male lion can't take down a rather healthy strong bull too.[img]images/smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]
There is a big difference between a cow, a adult cow, a old cow or young etc.
There is a massive difference between a young bull, old bull or prime adult bull. But still all have never been seen becoming victim to a lone lion.
And one picture of a lioness attempting a buffalo is pointless, where is the rest of the pride, you know its there, hence the young participating, its just one still shot of a long event.
RE: Lion Predation - Pckts - 01-18-2015
(01-16-2015, 02:03 AM)'TheLioness' Wrote: Thats true, I am sure there are accounts of it happening, as there are unreported accounts of tigers doing it too, it has happened for tigers on guar, but only once have we seen a video, it would be nice to see a video on a bull attack. Like you said even when it is not a very sick animal, they attack still when its in their favor, ambush, at night, ect.
Do bull guar travel in small herds like the cape buffalo?
Bull gaur are just like Bull Cape Buffalo,
they will travel alone most of the time until its time to breed then they will travel with the herd.
In response to @Pantherinae statement about aggression of a Cape compared to a Gaur. Its impossible to say, the myth about Cape buffalo not being domesticated is false.
*This image is copyright of its original author
*This image is copyright of its original author
At the end of the day, a Gaur or Water Buffalo is much larger and have ever bit the weaponary even more so in terms of absolute bulk and Muscel mass, especially when speaking of a bull Gaur.
The only difference is, Cape buffalo live in larger herds, but lions combat that with prides. Still most of their attempts are on seperated cape buffalo and if the herd comes back to help, they quickly abort the hunt. Also in response to seeing a Lion take down a adult Cape as easy as raja, I have never seen any lion take down an adult Cape buffalo in 2 minutes. Rajas kill on that cow was the most impressive display of hunting with a mission I have ever seen. He avoided attack, locked a throat hold and silenced the bovine in a matter of seconds. He was so strong that bovine could not even budge him. It was like a noose tightening every time the gaur pulled back.
RE: Lion Predation - Pckts - 01-18-2015
(01-17-2015, 08:57 PM)'Siegfried' Wrote:(01-17-2015, 04:45 PM)'Pantherinae' Wrote:'faess dateline='' Wrote: And this is why, despite a huge weight disadvantage, a bear or wild boar will be a bigger problem than a buffalo in terms of predations for big cats. There is no uniqueness of killing a huge bovine when single smaller predators have done the same.
It depends on The bear. I small ones are easy prey, but bigger bears would not be a smart thing to challenge, because a big male bear would beat up and destroy every male lion/tiger,
I am not saying that a bear makes for an easy meal, but a big cat (lion or tiger sized) being the ultimate AMBUSH predator might catch one off guard... apply a throat hold and take one out. The key is the element of surprise. Hunting a bear is VERY different than fighting a bear.
It has already been debunked, there is no "surprise hunting" an adult Bear. They have the keenest sense of smell of any predator, and their is no "quick kill" of a large bear. It is a battle and a long drawn out one at that. Look up any bear/tiger predation or fight, there is always signs of struggles, long battles and blood loss. Watch any interaction between a Sloth bear and Bengal, the sloth is always aware of the tigers presence and is forced to fight or flight.
RE: Lion Predation - chaos - 01-18-2015
(01-18-2015, 12:39 AM)'Pckts' Wrote:(01-17-2015, 12:57 AM)'chaos' Wrote: Its silly to assume a male lion has never killed a bull buffalo. In most vids of lions killing buffalo,
the victims gender is not visible. There are quite a few vids of single lions (and lionesses) taking
full grown buffalo. To say conclusively none were male when genetalia wasn't visible is simply
difficult to believe. Anyhow, the matter is inconsequential. Pockets can claim what he wants.
There has never been a report from a eye witness or image or video of any predation ever occuring between a lone male lion and a lone bull buffalo. Even the one where its a cow (no testicles) still has 3 plus lions involved so its not a lone lion either way.
Oh really? The John Varty account isn't reliable because YOU say so. LMAO.
RE: Lion Predation - TheLioness - 01-18-2015
pckts, most of every account of a tiger with a guar, is just a dead body with a tiger eating off of it, so those don't count or are you being a tad bias still. It would be easier if you would just stop being so against lions for doing what comes natural, just my opinion, but you're always making it seem like your putting lions down, i dont really recall you ever just saying wow, cool video, the lioness killed a huge cow, or wow that male lion killed that huge buffalo alone.
Would just make it nicer you know, kinda degrading the lion is getting annoying, if your not doing it on purpose, then please take a look at it.
I showed a bunch of videos of a SINGLE lioness killing a buffalo, ADULT buffalo, your comment on the picture is funny, "where is the pride you know its there" Who cares? The lioness can take it down alone, then they come into feed, I posted a good collection of them, I don't want to hear, difference between young, old, blah blah, its just excuses, you just dont want to accept it, I just dont understand why you HATE LIONS so much! [img]images/smilies/angry.gif[/img]
RE: Lion Predation - chaos - 01-18-2015
There is a thinly veiled undertone of LvT to his posts.
RE: Lion Predation - TheLioness - 01-18-2015
I don't think he watched half the videos, just picked out a picture, where i didnt even state the buffalo was killed. Just showing it, as I've shown enough evidence of single females taking buffalo down alone, the picture could assume she was about to do it too.
Many tsaro lionesses have killed adult cows alone
"The only difference is, Cape buffalo live in larger herds, but lions combat that with prides. Still most of their attempts are on seperated cape buffalo and if the herd comes back to help, they quickly abort the hunt. Also in response to seeing a Lion take down a adult Cape as easy as raja, I have never seen any lion take down an adult Cape buffalo in 2 minutes. Rajas kill on that cow was the most impressive display of hunting with a mission I have ever seen. He avoided attack, locked a throat hold and silenced the bovine in a matter of seconds. He was so strong that bovine could not even budge him. It was like a noose tightening every time the gaur pulled back."
Guess you didn't watch any of my videos of a female lion doing this alone and even killing a calf too, your just ignored the videos.
RE: Lion Predation - TheLioness - 01-18-2015
This video shows from beginning to end, lioness avoiding injuryfrom a charging buffalo down a very nasty looking slope, avoids injury on back, jumps on her and gets to throat, then nose in the matter of seconds, if this video doesn't impress you FAR more than rajas video, then your are truly a lion hating person.[img]images/smilies/dodgy.gif[/img]