WildFact
Lions of Sabi Sands - Printable Version

+- WildFact (https://wildfact.com/forum)
+-- Forum: Information Section (https://wildfact.com/forum/forum-information-section)
+--- Forum: Terrestrial Wild Animals (https://wildfact.com/forum/forum-terrestrial-wild-animals)
+---- Forum: Wild Cats (https://wildfact.com/forum/forum-wild-cats)
+----- Forum: Lion (https://wildfact.com/forum/forum-lion)
+----- Thread: Lions of Sabi Sands (/topic-lions-of-sabi-sands)

Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360 361 362 363 364 365 366 367 368 369 370 371 372 373 374 375 376 377 378 379 380 381 382 383 384 385 386 387 388 389 390 391 392 393 394 395 396 397 398 399 400 401 402 403 404 405 406 407 408 409 410 411 412 413 414 415 416 417 418 419 420 421 422 423 424 425 426 427 428 429 430 431 432 433 434 435 436 437 438 439 440 441 442 443 444 445 446 447 448 449 450 451 452 453 454 455 456 457 458 459 460 461 462 463 464 465 466 467 468 469 470 471 472 473 474 475 476 477 478 479 480 481 482 483 484 485 486 487 488 489 490 491 492 493 494 495 496 497 498 499 500 501 502 503 504 505 506 507 508 509 510 511 512 513 514 515 516 517 518 519 520 521 522 523 524 525 526 527 528 529 530 531 532 533 534 535 536 537 538 539 540 541 542 543 544 545 546 547 548 549 550 551 552 553 554 555 556 557 558 559 560 561 562 563 564 565 566 567 568 569 570 571 572 573 574 575 576 577 578 579 580 581 582 583 584 585 586 587 588 589 590 591 592 593 594 595 596 597 598 599 600 601 602 603 604 605 606 607 608 609 610 611 612 613 614 615 616 617 618 619 620 621 622 623 624 625 626 627 628 629 630 631 632 633 634 635 636 637 638 639 640 641 642 643 644 645 646 647 648 649 650 651 652 653 654 655 656 657 658 659 660 661 662 663 664 665 666 667 668 669 670 671 672 673 674 675 676 677 678 679 680 681 682 683 684 685 686 687 688 689 690 691 692 693 694 695 696 697 698 699 700 701 702 703 704 705 706 707 708 709 710 711 712 713 714 715 716 717 718 719 720 721 722 723 724 725 726 727 728 729 730 731 732 733 734 735 736 737 738 739 740 741 742 743 744 745 746 747 748 749 750 751 752 753 754 755 756 757 758 759 760 761 762 763 764 765 766 767 768 769 770 771 772 773 774 775 776 777 778 779 780 781 782 783 784 785 786 787 788 789 790 791 792 793 794 795 796 797 798 799 800 801 802 803 804 805 806 807 808 809 810 811 812 813 814 815 816 817 818 819 820 821 822 823 824 825 826 827 828 829 830 831 832 833 834 835 836 837 838 839 840 841 842 843 844 845 846 847 848 849 850 851 852 853 854 855 856 857 858 859 860 861 862 863 864 865 866 867 868 869 870 871 872 873 874 875 876 877 878 879 880 881 882 883 884 885 886 887 888 889 890 891 892 893 894 895 896 897 898 899 900 901 902 903 904 905 906 907 908 909 910 911 912 913 914 915 916 917 918 919 920 921 922 923 924 925 926 927 928 929 930 931 932 933 934 935 936 937 938 939 940 941 942 943 944 945 946 947 948 949 950 951 952 953 954 955 956 957 958 959 960 961 962 963 964 965 966 967 968 969 970 971 972 973 974 975 976 977 978 979 980 981 982 983 984 985 986 987 988 989 990 991 992 993 994 995 996 997 998 999 1000 1001 1002 1003 1004 1005 1006 1007 1008 1009 1010 1011 1012 1013 1014 1015 1016 1017 1018 1019 1020 1021 1022 1023 1024 1025 1026 1027 1028 1029 1030 1031 1032 1033 1034 1035 1036 1037 1038 1039 1040 1041 1042 1043 1044 1045 1046 1047 1048 1049 1050 1051 1052 1053 1054 1055 1056 1057 1058 1059 1060 1061 1062 1063 1064 1065 1066 1067 1068 1069 1070 1071 1072 1073 1074 1075 1076 1077 1078 1079 1080 1081 1082 1083 1084 1085 1086 1087 1088 1089 1090 1091 1092 1093 1094 1095 1096 1097 1098 1099 1100 1101 1102 1103 1104 1105 1106 1107 1108 1109 1110 1111 1112 1113 1114 1115 1116 1117 1118 1119 1120 1121 1122 1123 1124 1125 1126 1127 1128 1129 1130 1131 1132 1133 1134 1135 1136 1137 1138 1139 1140 1141 1142 1143 1144 1145 1146 1147 1148 1149 1150 1151 1152 1153 1154 1155 1156 1157 1158 1159 1160 1161

RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - Rabubi - 01-18-2024

(01-18-2024, 06:19 PM)KM600 Wrote: Just come across this post too, seems PCMs finally caught up with her.




This is great news! Hopefully the Tsalala female (and her future cubs from this liaison) will enjoy the protection and stability the PCMs provide to their current prides.

RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - Mwk85 - 01-18-2024

Footage of PCM and Tsalala female 



RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - Mapokser - 01-18-2024

I wonder if Tsalala could move to Singita to be within the PCM's territory.

Maybe she can avoid the NK Breakaway in the north.

But anyway, it'll be interesting to see what the BDM will do now. They have been going through difficult times, they never managed to get the upper hand against the Ndhzengas and when they were finally taking over the NK pride after almost a year, they lost their territory to Kambulas, they moved further west and got chased by the PCM, now with this interaction on the kill it's more clear than ever that the Kambulas have the complete upper hand over them.

There are still many opportunities if they look at the right place, if they move further north there are a lot of prides ready to be taken, some with only one dominant male or none at all, not to mention the possibility of new breakaway prides since I believe RR has a bunch of daughters.

RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - NLAL11 - 01-19-2024

(01-18-2024, 10:48 PM)Mapokser Wrote: I wonder if Tsalala could move to Singita to be within the PCM's territory.

Maybe she can avoid the NK Breakaway in the north.

But anyway, it'll be interesting to see what the BDM will do now. They have been going through difficult times, they never managed to get the upper hand against the Ndhzengas and when they were finally taking over the NK pride after almost a year, they lost their territory to Kambulas, they moved further west and got chased by the PCM, now with this interaction on the kill it's more clear than ever that the Kambulas have the complete upper hand over them.

There are still many opportunities if they look at the right place, if they move further north there are a lot of prides ready to be taken, some with only one dominant male or none at all, not to mention the possibility of new breakaway prides since I believe RR has a bunch of daughters.

This is my concern. She's got a great little bit of territory in Londolozi along the river. Seems she manages to avoid all the drama. They're probably the best coalition for her to mate with, besides maybe the N'waswitshakas, but it'll increase the chance of her coming into conflict with the Nkuhuma breakaways, or even Mhangeni or Ximungwe prides. And though she's ready to have cubs now, it would be best for her to join another lone lionesses first. She won't want to once she's a mother.

Red Road's (5) daughters will almost certainly form a breakaway pride at this point, unless Red Road gets overthrown soon, which could happen. They could fill the space left by the Talamati breakaways. But the Kambula's will expand at some point, and it will probably be north. The Black Dam males will just lose out to them again.

RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - Mapokser - 01-19-2024

Yeah now would be the time for Tsalala's sister to leave her brothers and go mate with the PCM within that area of Singita ( where she and her brothers like to use to hunt ), if she where to join up with Tsalala there, it'd be a dream scenario.

As for the Kambulas expanding north, IDK, they never left the SS, they'd more likely, IMO, expand west, towards an area they know well and use a lot to hunt. Though like I said, if their sister would establish herself there then she might serve as a shield against the Kambula coalition, the same way the Kambulas avoid Mala Mala they may probably avoid the place their sister is.

This also happened back in the early 2000s, the dominant males of the Charleston pride couldn't oppose the Rollercoasters but they got to keep their status because the Rollercoasters never made a move to take their sisters' pride and they even interacted without hostilities multiple times, the Rollercoasters and the Charleston females.

RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - Mapokser - 01-19-2024

NK Breakaway subadult male:


*This image is copyright of its original author



*This image is copyright of its original author


RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - Duco Ndona - 01-19-2024

I doubt she will be moving. 

She is just mating with the local males to confuse paternity of any cubs she will give birth to. Mak was just exploring the area and got lucky. So this is not a take over, so she wont be tempted as much to move closer. 

Her territory is also far more dictated by the other pride territories than whatever the males do. Every pride around her is bigger and extremely hostile to her and she is fully aware of her bad position. Which is how she ended up in londolozi to begin with.

RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - NLAL11 - 01-19-2024

@Mapokser Interesting I didn't know that about the Rollercoasters and Charlestons. That would be ideal. I don't see them expanding west as there aren't really any lionesses, except the Tsalala girl. And just because they haven't left Sabi Sands yet doesn't mean they won't do so in the future.

@Duco Ndona Well she's inherited her mother's territory, but yes probably that's how she ended up there.

RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - Mapokser - 01-19-2024

@"NLAL1" there are/will be a lot of lionesses west of them, Manghenis, 2 Ximhungwes, 2 NK Breakaways and 2 Othawas.

All they have to do is oust the PCM, and in the very near future, they'll be able to easily do that if they want as they outnumber the PCM 4 to 2.

I always feared the Kambulas would be the west's doom, but hopefully they'll expand north instead of west.

RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - T_Ferguson - 01-19-2024

(01-19-2024, 06:35 AM)Mapokser Wrote: @"NLAL1" there are/will be a lot of lionesses west of them, Manghenis, 2 Ximhungwes, 2 NK Breakaways and 2 Othawas.

All they have to do is oust the PCM, and in the very near future, they'll be able to easily do that if they want as they outnumber the PCM 4 to 2.

I always feared the Kambulas would be the west's doom, but hopefully they'll expand north instead of west.

It seems like there just aren't any finishers in Sabi right now.  Maybe the Gijimas.  The PCM's are strong and didn't finish off Skorro when they had him, Kambula's didn't finish NK, or do anything about the BDM's the other night.  BDM's didn't do anything with the N'Was male a few months ago.  I mean... Kinky Tail and Mr. T are rolling over at all this kindness.

That said.  Sabi has a LOT of male lions in what I think is a pretty small space.  2024 could be a year of fireworks and sadness.

RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - Mapokser - 01-19-2024

Gijimas badly injured K3 but he fully recovered.

Regardless, this is the norm, more often than not the lion caught by 2 isn't finished.

Mapogos were no exception. Mr.T and KT didn't inflict any serious injure on their half-brother when they caught him in 2008, nor did they do anything to the remaining Manyeleti male when he got caught in 2009, hell 3 Mapogo caught the Golf Course male in 2009 ( in that video at night in the north ) and also did nothing to him.

It's up in the air why things are how they are, but the level of threat involved may be at play, for exemple, Ndhzenga was 1/4, 5th Majingilane 1/5, Delaporte 1/7, and Nhenha 1/2 who were territorial in the area the 2 PCM where trying to take for a long time, same as the 2 Manyeleti when the Mapogos killed the first one, 2 v 2 against males trying to take the northern part of the Mapogo territory, in all these scenarios at least one male was badly injured or died.

Meanwhile Tumbela and BDM aren't a huge threat to PCM and Kambulas respectively... Or it may be completely coincidental and sometimes the lions are in the mood to give tons of damage and sometimes they are cautious about risking injuries and energy.

Still, in the case of the Kambulas, they weren't even close of being territorial when they caught NK, and are just starting to establish themselves now so they not attacking BDM or killing NK may be also due to inexperience.

RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - NLAL11 - 01-19-2024

(01-19-2024, 06:35 AM)Mapokser Wrote: @"NLAL1" there are/will be a lot of lionesses west of them, Manghenis, 2 Ximhungwes, 2 NK Breakaways and 2 Othawas.

All they have to do is oust the PCM, and in the very near future, they'll be able to easily do that if they want as they outnumber the PCM 4 to 2.

I always feared the Kambulas would be the west's doom, but hopefully they'll expand north instead of west.

I meant immediately west of them. Depends where they set up shop. I was under the impression they were currently doing so in the Djuma, Chitwa Chitwa, Nkorho, Arsathusa area - with a bit of northern Londolozi. If the PC males came all the way to Elephant Plains then there's still quite a bit of space between the Kambula males and all those females. However, if they start to establish territory in Singita, then yes all those lionesses will be quite close to them. But if they're focusing on the Nkuhuma pride, which seems most likely as they currently don't have two big aggressive males defending them, then they'll be far from those other lionesses you listed.

RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - Tr1x24 - 01-20-2024

NK female approached Kambula males, they went after her for potential mating, but their sister didnt like her presence:



This is a problem, as sister might be in real danger when there will be more NK females around.

RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - KM600 - 01-20-2024

(01-20-2024, 06:44 PM)Tr1x24 Wrote: NK female approached Kambula males, they went after her for potential mating, but their sister didnt like her presence:



This is a problem, as sister might be in real danger when there will be more NK females around.

Think this just signals their relationship is coming to an end, Kambula males aren’t going to keep putting up with this, she’s either gonna end up getting put in her place or the Kambula males are going to willingly seek out Nkuhuma females and she’ll get the hint anyways.

RE: Lions of Sabi Sands - Mapokser - 01-20-2024

Nkuhuma female was attracted by the roars of the new dominant males: