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+----- Thread: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara (/topic-other-male-lion-coalitions-from-masai-mara)
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RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - BA0701 - 02-02-2025
(02-02-2025, 07:56 PM)T_Ferguson Wrote:(02-02-2025, 07:14 PM)BA0701 Wrote: There is clearly a way that the animals and people can coexist, as has been done in recent decades. It isn't until park management decided to play God, choosing who lives and who dies, and the government ceased enforcing existing laws, that things became a problem.
Sorry, this whole area has been on my mind for the last year. The things that go on here, and the as you say, picking and choosing. Take Nashapol the Cheetah and her 5 cubs. They essentially chaperoned her and those cubs around for several months. NOW... Cheetah's are not long for this earth, and what humans are doing with them and these transplant programs is horrendous, but again... who are we to intervene? I mean, we've already done the ultimate intervene by wiping out 75%+ of their habitat, but again... we choose who lives and dies.
As for the Masai, and the governments here, please don't get me started. They make Western Governments look like German Automobile engines of efficiency with how corrupt and greedy they are. Basically a year apart, the 2 most recognizable lions on planet earth were killed by humans and covered up. Humans that received a LOT of money to NOT do what they just did. Humans that want to do it to basically all the rest of the vermin on the lands they deem to be theirs by right. Maybe they are correct. Maybe it is their land. Maybe they should do what they want, but ... I guess I just need to stop. Who am I to criticize. My ancestors wiped out the plains.
The fact that these things continue to happen there, tells me it is intentional. It isn't like it hasn't been discussed, in depth, all over the web, not just here, about the human slaughter of these creatures that has been going on for years now. They clearly are aware of the general consensus, and it continues to happen in a very public way. There is something else at play, and the only thing that makes sense, given everything that has been happening, is they want the land that these creatures call home. When it first started, it didn't make sense, because it was clearly going to impact tourism, but now, it has become obvious that they want the tourists gone, so that they can proceed in the dark.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - T_Ferguson - 02-02-2025
which would explain why they are killing the lions everybody knows. Olonkera likely will be next.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - Mwarcaar - 02-02-2025
(02-02-2025, 08:05 PM)BA0701 Wrote:(02-02-2025, 07:56 PM)T_Ferguson Wrote:(02-02-2025, 07:14 PM)BA0701 Wrote: There is clearly a way that the animals and people can coexist, as has been done in recent decades. It isn't until park management decided to play God, choosing who lives and who dies, and the government ceased enforcing existing laws, that things became a problem.
Sorry, this whole area has been on my mind for the last year. The things that go on here, and the as you say, picking and choosing. Take Nashapol the Cheetah and her 5 cubs. They essentially chaperoned her and those cubs around for several months. NOW... Cheetah's are not long for this earth, and what humans are doing with them and these transplant programs is horrendous, but again... who are we to intervene? I mean, we've already done the ultimate intervene by wiping out 75%+ of their habitat, but again... we choose who lives and dies.
As for the Masai, and the governments here, please don't get me started. They make Western Governments look like German Automobile engines of efficiency with how corrupt and greedy they are. Basically a year apart, the 2 most recognizable lions on planet earth were killed by humans and covered up. Humans that received a LOT of money to NOT do what they just did. Humans that want to do it to basically all the rest of the vermin on the lands they deem to be theirs by right. Maybe they are correct. Maybe it is their land. Maybe they should do what they want, but ... I guess I just need to stop. Who am I to criticize. My ancestors wiped out the plains.
The fact that these things continue to happen there, tells me it is intentional. It isn't like it hasn't been discussed, in depth, all over the web, not just here, about the human slaughter of these creatures that has been going on for years now. They clearly are aware of the general consensus, and it continues to happen in a very public way. There is something else at play, and the only thing that makes sense, given everything that has been happening, is they want the land that these creatures call home. When it first started, it didn't make sense, because it was clearly going to impact tourism, but now, it has become obvious that they want the tourists gone, so that they can proceed in the dark.
you criticize the authorities and the rangers but without them olobor, lurkurlup and oloimona would have already died a long time ago and all of natural causes.
It was the rangers who separated Spiky and his brother from Olobor by getting very close to them when they fought and then the authorities treated Olobor.
lurkurlup took a giraffe's hoof to the head (the cause of his runny nose), the spear on his lip, the snake bite, oloimona after his fight with jesse, which crippled him for life and each time It was the authorities who treated them.
and as for the Masai herders, their herd is their means of substances and unlike the American rancher they do not kill all the predators which are on their land.
they only defend their herd and sometimes predators are killed.
there are more than 600 lions in the Masai Mara, that's more than there are wolves in Yellowstone National Park, more than 5 times more in a much smaller area
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - BA0701 - 02-02-2025
I am going to lock this thread, will restore it once things have settled.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - T_Ferguson - 02-14-2025
The fall of a coalition and a pride. This may be my last post on this region. SO angry!!
Oloimina was out searching for Lorkulup in places he wouldn't normally have been and got caught.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - afortich - 02-14-2025
Topi boy, impressive.
For those that wonder how many hyenas a single lion could handle.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - Mwk85 - 02-14-2025
Oloshipa (in front) and Oloimina (in the back) with the Rongai Pride.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - KM600 - 02-14-2025
(02-02-2025, 10:08 PM)Mwarcaar Wrote:(02-02-2025, 08:05 PM)BA0701 Wrote:(02-02-2025, 07:56 PM)T_Ferguson Wrote:(02-02-2025, 07:14 PM)BA0701 Wrote: There is clearly a way that the animals and people can coexist, as has been done in recent decades. It isn't until park management decided to play God, choosing who lives and who dies, and the government ceased enforcing existing laws, that things became a problem.
Sorry, this whole area has been on my mind for the last year. The things that go on here, and the as you say, picking and choosing. Take Nashapol the Cheetah and her 5 cubs. They essentially chaperoned her and those cubs around for several months. NOW... Cheetah's are not long for this earth, and what humans are doing with them and these transplant programs is horrendous, but again... who are we to intervene? I mean, we've already done the ultimate intervene by wiping out 75%+ of their habitat, but again... we choose who lives and dies.
As for the Masai, and the governments here, please don't get me started. They make Western Governments look like German Automobile engines of efficiency with how corrupt and greedy they are. Basically a year apart, the 2 most recognizable lions on planet earth were killed by humans and covered up. Humans that received a LOT of money to NOT do what they just did. Humans that want to do it to basically all the rest of the vermin on the lands they deem to be theirs by right. Maybe they are correct. Maybe it is their land. Maybe they should do what they want, but ... I guess I just need to stop. Who am I to criticize. My ancestors wiped out the plains.
The fact that these things continue to happen there, tells me it is intentional. It isn't like it hasn't been discussed, in depth, all over the web, not just here, about the human slaughter of these creatures that has been going on for years now. They clearly are aware of the general consensus, and it continues to happen in a very public way. There is something else at play, and the only thing that makes sense, given everything that has been happening, is they want the land that these creatures call home. When it first started, it didn't make sense, because it was clearly going to impact tourism, but now, it has become obvious that they want the tourists gone, so that they can proceed in the dark.
you criticize the authorities and the rangers but without them olobor, lurkurlup and oloimona would have already died a long time ago and all of natural causes.It was the rangers who separated Spiky and his brother from Olobor by getting very close to them when they fought and then the authorities treated Olobor.
lurkurlup took a giraffe's hoof to the head (the cause of his runny nose), the spear on his lip, the snake bite, oloimona after his fight with jesse, which crippled him for life and each time It was the authorities who treated them.
and as for the Masai herders, their herd is their means of substances and unlike the American rancher they do not kill all the predators which are on their land.
they only defend their herd and sometimes predators are killed.
there are more than 600 lions in the Masai Mara, that's more than there are wolves in Yellowstone National Park, more than 5 times more in a much smaller area
I can see a reason for the thread being locked now.. it's true the BRBs each received quite a bit of treatment from vets but I believe they all would've survived from their injuries, minus maybe the snake bite Lorkulup had, all vet help did was speed up their recovery. Oloimina received major damage from that fight with Jesse mainly from his hip / back leg, areas that the rangers couldn't treat minus cleaning it up a bit, but as we see he never recovered. Oloshipa was most damaged to his face and likely would have survived, Olobor literally went back straight back to his brothers in a matter of days after taking that beating, it would've taken him longer but he still prolly would have survived. Lorkulup was speared twice so u best believe he deserved vet treatment, not that it mattered too much now they finally killed him.
Ur point about the Masai herders protecting their herd on their land is completely contradictory as many of these lions are dying in their own territories. How can they be defending their herd when they themselves are putting the herd in danger of lions after encroaching on land which isn't theirs? Three BRBs dead, and all three most likely killed by herders..
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - KM600 - 02-14-2025
Speaking about herders, some come into Masai Mara from Tanzania and poisoned a pride, believed to be the same pride the Sopa boys control, but there were mixed reports last update I seen. It was first reported two males were dead but apparently one was treated leaving only one dead, all their 10 cubs were said to be dead as well as a few lionesses. Quite a few hyenas were also killed too. This happened not long after Lorkulup was confirmed to have died. Apparently Masai Mara themselves are claiming he could've been poisoned too, but I figure it's easier for them to blame herders who have already been caught for killing one of the Sopa boys, also knowing they come from Tanzania, then admit this is entirely their fault.
There's no doubt in my mind he wasn't killed by an Elland, do u know how much of a fatal mistake he'd have to make in order for an Elland to spear him through his chest, with its horns coming out through his ribs and instantly killing him, the same lion that would take buffalos down by himself for fun. 'They died on top of each other' but each carcass was separated after hyenas allegedly fed on them, and let's not forget Lorkulup's body was found so far that even one ranger claimed he'd never been seen him that far out.
I have seen quite a few of my favourite lions die already, but they have went out fairly, and I can accept that for what it is. It seems pointless following Masai Mara lions with things like this happening. It's only a matter of time before Oloimina / Oloshipa or any of the Rongai boys find themselves in a similar situation.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - sunless - 02-14-2025
(02-02-2025, 10:08 PM)Mwarcaar Wrote:(02-02-2025, 08:05 PM)BA0701 Wrote:(02-02-2025, 07:56 PM)T_Ferguson Wrote:(02-02-2025, 07:14 PM)BA0701 Wrote: There is clearly a way that the animals and people can coexist, as has been done in recent decades. It isn't until park management decided to play God, choosing who lives and who dies, and the government ceased enforcing existing laws, that things became a problem.
Sorry, this whole area has been on my mind for the last year. The things that go on here, and the as you say, picking and choosing. Take Nashapol the Cheetah and her 5 cubs. They essentially chaperoned her and those cubs around for several months. NOW... Cheetah's are not long for this earth, and what humans are doing with them and these transplant programs is horrendous, but again... who are we to intervene? I mean, we've already done the ultimate intervene by wiping out 75%+ of their habitat, but again... we choose who lives and dies.
As for the Masai, and the governments here, please don't get me started. They make Western Governments look like German Automobile engines of efficiency with how corrupt and greedy they are. Basically a year apart, the 2 most recognizable lions on planet earth were killed by humans and covered up. Humans that received a LOT of money to NOT do what they just did. Humans that want to do it to basically all the rest of the vermin on the lands they deem to be theirs by right. Maybe they are correct. Maybe it is their land. Maybe they should do what they want, but ... I guess I just need to stop. Who am I to criticize. My ancestors wiped out the plains.
The fact that these things continue to happen there, tells me it is intentional. It isn't like it hasn't been discussed, in depth, all over the web, not just here, about the human slaughter of these creatures that has been going on for years now. They clearly are aware of the general consensus, and it continues to happen in a very public way. There is something else at play, and the only thing that makes sense, given everything that has been happening, is they want the land that these creatures call home. When it first started, it didn't make sense, because it was clearly going to impact tourism, but now, it has become obvious that they want the tourists gone, so that they can proceed in the dark.
you criticize the authorities and the rangers but without them olobor, lurkurlup and oloimona would have already died a long time ago and all of natural causes.It was the rangers who separated Spiky and his brother from Olobor by getting very close to them when they fought and then the authorities treated Olobor.lurkurlup took a giraffe's hoof to the head (the cause of his runny nose), the spear on his lip, the snake bite, oloimona after his fight with jesse, which crippled him for life and each time It was the authorities who treated them.and as for the Masai herders, their herd is their means of substances and unlike the American rancher they do not kill all the predators which are on their land.they only defend their herd and sometimes predators are killed.there are more than 600 lions in the Masai Mara, that's more than there are wolves in Yellowstone National Park, more than 5 times more in a much smaller area
I think you are just so blindsided with the help that BRB had gotten, hypothetically if some BRB died and not been treated do you think the other lions would be safe out there from herders/human wildlife conflict? NOOO.
As you also mention about Lorkulup injury on his lips/mouth due to spear why in the first place he have that its because of HWC and when even the you so called good authorities do not even acknowledge the death of Olobor in human hands, and the fact they are hiding the fact that grazing is at large in the Maasai Mara.
The problem is with not helping the lions/wildlife the problem is with the HUMAN WILDLIFE CONFLICT, if HWC is to disappear the need for treatment to these lions will also disappear. Did you really think lions can maintain their population with the way they are killed, its like its the human who controls their population of lions in the Mara and not the lions themselves.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - Ttimemarti - 02-14-2025
I’m just starting to learn about the masi lions again and I have a question why was the black rock male Orpadan renamed?
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - Fenix123 - 02-15-2025
Oloshipa and Oloimina patrolling their territory
Credits to lemurt_wildlife and alexiachevron
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - adamstocks16 - 02-16-2025
(02-14-2025, 05:41 PM)Ttimemarti Wrote: I’m just starting to learn about the masi lions again and I have a question why was the black rock male Orpadan renamed?
I believe the name Oloshipa came from one of the local Maasai guides who spent quite a lot of time with the BRB’s in their younger days. There was also a cheetah called Orpadan, who was leader of the famous Tano Bora coalition so perhaps they renamed him to avoid any confusion between them.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - Mwarcaar - 02-17-2025
(02-14-2025, 03:10 PM)KM600 Wrote: Speaking about herders, some come into Masai Mara from Tanzania and poisoned a pride, believed to be the same pride the Sopa boys control, but there were mixed reports last update I seen. It was first reported two males were dead but apparently one was treated leaving only one dead, all their 10 cubs were said to be dead as well as a few lionesses. Quite a few hyenas were also killed too. This happened not long after Lorkulup was confirmed to have died. Apparently Masai Mara themselves are claiming he could've been poisoned too, but I figure it's easier for them to blame herders who have already been caught for killing one of the Sopa boys, also knowing they come from Tanzania, then admit this is entirely their fault.
There's no doubt in my mind he wasn't killed by an Elland, do u know how much of a fatal mistake he'd have to make in order for an Elland to spear him through his chest, with its horns coming out through his ribs and instantly killing him, the same lion that would take buffalos down by himself for fun. 'They died on top of each other' but each carcass was separated after hyenas allegedly fed on them, and let's not forget Lorkulup's body was found so far that even one ranger claimed he'd never been seen him that far out.
I have seen quite a few of my favourite lions die already, but they have went out fairly, and I can accept that for what it is. It seems pointless following Masai Mara lions with things like this happening. It's only a matter of time before Oloimina / Oloshipa or any of the Rongai boys find themselves in a similar situation.
(02-14-2025, 04:26 PM)sunless Wrote:(02-02-2025, 10:08 PM)Mwarcaar Wrote:(02-02-2025, 08:05 PM)BA0701 Wrote:(02-02-2025, 07:56 PM)T_Ferguson Wrote:(02-02-2025, 07:14 PM)BA0701 Wrote: There is clearly a way that the animals and people can coexist, as has been done in recent decades. It isn't until park management decided to play God, choosing who lives and who dies, and the government ceased enforcing existing laws, that things became a problem.
Sorry, this whole area has been on my mind for the last year. The things that go on here, and the as you say, picking and choosing. Take Nashapol the Cheetah and her 5 cubs. They essentially chaperoned her and those cubs around for several months. NOW... Cheetah's are not long for this earth, and what humans are doing with them and these transplant programs is horrendous, but again... who are we to intervene? I mean, we've already done the ultimate intervene by wiping out 75%+ of their habitat, but again... we choose who lives and dies.
As for the Masai, and the governments here, please don't get me started. They make Western Governments look like German Automobile engines of efficiency with how corrupt and greedy they are. Basically a year apart, the 2 most recognizable lions on planet earth were killed by humans and covered up. Humans that received a LOT of money to NOT do what they just did. Humans that want to do it to basically all the rest of the vermin on the lands they deem to be theirs by right. Maybe they are correct. Maybe it is their land. Maybe they should do what they want, but ... I guess I just need to stop. Who am I to criticize. My ancestors wiped out the plains.
The fact that these things continue to happen there, tells me it is intentional. It isn't like it hasn't been discussed, in depth, all over the web, not just here, about the human slaughter of these creatures that has been going on for years now. They clearly are aware of the general consensus, and it continues to happen in a very public way. There is something else at play, and the only thing that makes sense, given everything that has been happening, is they want the land that these creatures call home. When it first started, it didn't make sense, because it was clearly going to impact tourism, but now, it has become obvious that they want the tourists gone, so that they can proceed in the dark.
you criticize the authorities and the rangers but without them olobor, lurkurlup and oloimona would have already died a long time ago and all of natural causes.It was the rangers who separated Spiky and his brother from Olobor by getting very close to them when they fought and then the authorities treated Olobor.lurkurlup took a giraffe's hoof to the head (the cause of his runny nose), the spear on his lip, the snake bite, oloimona after his fight with jesse, which crippled him for life and each time It was the authorities who treated them.and as for the Masai herders, their herd is their means of substances and unlike the American rancher they do not kill all the predators which are on their land.they only defend their herd and sometimes predators are killed.there are more than 600 lions in the Masai Mara, that's more than there are wolves in Yellowstone National Park, more than 5 times more in a much smaller area
I think you are just so blindsided with the help that BRB had gotten, hypothetically if some BRB died and not been treated do you think the other lions would be safe out there from herders/human wildlife conflict? NOOO.
As you also mention about Lorkulup injury on his lips/mouth due to spear why in the first place he have that its because of HWC and when even the you so called good authorities do not even acknowledge the death of Olobor in human hands, and the fact they are hiding the fact that grazing is at large in the Maasai Mara.
The problem is with not helping the lions/wildlife the problem is with the HUMAN WILDLIFE CONFLICT, if HWC is to disappear the need for treatment to these lions will also disappear. Did you really think lions can maintain their population with the way they are killed, its like its the human who controls their population of lions in the Mara and not the lions themselves.
lions, the Masai and their herds have lived in this region for centuries and these lions have never been in danger of extinction, on the contrary the Masai Mara and the Serengeti are home to the densest lion population in all of Africa.
850 to 900 lions in the Masai Mara and over 3000 in the Serengeti, the Kruger National Park which is larger than the Masai Mara and the Serengeti combined is only home to around 1700 lions for example.
Human-animal conflicts exist everywhere in Africa and everywhere else in the world and will always exist.
as I have already said, the Masai only attack lions which attack their herds.
and yes I can say that the Masai Mara is the region where lions are safest.
the lion population in the Masai Mara is maintaining very well.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - sunless - 02-17-2025
(02-17-2025, 10:56 PM)Mwarcaar Wrote: as I have already said, the Masai only attack lions which attack their herds.
and yes I can say that the Masai Mara is the region where lions are safest.
In the first place why would the lions attack the their cattle herd, because they are ILLIGALLY GRAZING their cattle INSIDE THE RESERVE. Also would not call it safe when the people who have the authorities to protect the lions and other wildlife take the side with the killers and act like nothing happened. Do you also know how they retaliate if their cattle were killed inside the reserve they deliberately poison carcass and leave it to carnivores (lions, hyenas, etc) to feed to kill almost the entire pride or coalition so that their cattle herd would illegally graze inside the reserve. Look at what happened in Serengeti in the past week where 13 hyenas was killed due to poison and 5 lions killed due to that poison and the other lions are still recovering from that poison. Do you also really think on how fast ang big some of the cattle herd is getting can lions and other wildlife animal can adjust to that and maintain their population when the cattle herd is encroaching inside the reserve where they should have lived protected from those.