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+----- Thread: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage (/topic-avoca-male-lions-and-their-male-lineage)
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RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - afortich - 04-03-2025
Remembering Dzwihala Talamati
RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - KM600 - 04-03-2025
(04-03-2025, 09:52 AM)afortich Wrote: Remembering Dzwihala Talamati
Miss this boy, was my favourite lion. Think this was around the time they had one of their first encounters with Ndzengas.
RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - afortich - 04-03-2025
(04-03-2025, 01:21 PM)KM600 Wrote:(04-03-2025, 09:52 AM)afortich Wrote: Remembering Dzwihala Talamati
Miss this boy, was my favourite lion. Think this was around the time they had one of their first encounters with Ndzengas.
I heard you bro, missing him too.
Dad DM Avoca was my favorite lion alive at his time, and I was so happy when Dziwahala was bonding with dad DM to the point of almost forming a coalition, thus, thinking it was DM's second chance.
However, when DM died, Dziwahala became one of my favorites, then, Khanya together with others.
Nature is so weird, I always thought that Khanya was going to be the one not making it this long because he used to spend a lot of time with Talamati pride or alone, and sometimes with his brother and dad, or even Mohawk with his Nkuhuma sons. I always wondered if Khanya didn't fit with other lions, which is clearly not the case.
Anyway, now Khanya is one of my favorites.
RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - Guillermo94 - 04-03-2025
(04-03-2025, 01:21 PM)KM600 Wrote:(04-03-2025, 09:52 AM)afortich Wrote: Remembering Dzwihala Talamati
Miss this boy, was my favourite lion. Think this was around the time they had one of their first encounters with Ndzengas.
What a very beautiful lion. I noticed his similar to Nukhuma male lion.
RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - Tr1x24 - 04-04-2025
(04-03-2025, 10:29 PM)afortich Wrote: Nature is so weird, I always thought that Khanya was going to be the one not making it this long
If we look at history, more dominant/confident males are more prone to being killed, because they have more "guts" to face competition, and if they dont have backup on same lvl, they are in trouble.
Its a a thin line in between being "fearless warrior" (lets say LM Gijima for example) and being dead.
If we look some of more recent deaths, male who was more dominant in coalition died first : Nhenha, Styx, bigger S.Avoca, Guernsey, Ncile, Mandevu, K4 almost, etc.
Thats not coincidence.
RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - afortich - 04-04-2025
(Yesterday, 12:03 AM)Tr1x24 Wrote:(04-03-2025, 10:29 PM)afortich Wrote: Nature is so weird, I always thought that Khanya was going to be the one not making it this long
If we look at history, more dominant/confident males are more prone to being killed, because they have more "guts" to face competition, and if they dont have backup on same lvl, they are in trouble.
Its a a thin line in between being "fearless warrior" (lets say LM Gijima for example) and being dead.
If we look some of more recent deaths, male who was more dominant in coalition died first : Nhenha, Styx, bigger S.Avoca, Guernsey, Ncile, Mandevu, K4 almost, etc.
Thats not coincidence.
You're right buddy.
Furthermore, I think Khanya appears to be very confident but probably more careful when picking a fight and/or deciding when to fight.
RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - Mapokser - 04-04-2025
And now Talamati is mating with a Mangheni female, Talamati who's the more dominant/has a bigger drive to be territorial than the Nkuhuma male.
I'm not really expecting the PCM to show up as they have no interest in Manghenis but if they or some other males attracted by the female in estrus shows up, Talamati may end up being the primary target.
I wonder if lions, or rather Talamati specifically, has a good understanding that his partner is likely not gonna be willing to support him if a strong duo shows up.
Talamati may be under the impression that now's his time, at prime age with another big male well bonded to him, a female to mate and an abandoned territory to take.
RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - afortich - 04-04-2025
(Yesterday, 12:31 AM)Mapokser Wrote: And now Talamati is mating with a Mangheni female, Talamati who's the more dominant/has a bigger drive to be territorial than the Nkuhuma male.
I'm not really expecting the PCM to show up as they have no interest in Manghenis but if they or some other males attracted by the female in estrus shows up, Talamati may end up being the primary target.
I wonder if lions, or rather Talamati specifically, has a good understanding that his partner is likely not gonna be willing to support him if a strong duo shows up.
Talamati may be under the impression that now's his time, at prime age with another big male well bonded to him, a female to mate and an abandoned territory to take.
Agree with u bud.
My hope is that their bond is probably stronger compared to prior bonds of Nkuhuma (NYM), although not sure is greater than the one with Styx, thus motivating him to give a live/dead fight helping his pal Khanya.
RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - Tr1x24 - 04-04-2025
(Yesterday, 12:31 AM)Mapokser Wrote: I'm not really expecting the PCM to show up as they have no interest in Manghenis but if they or some other males attracted by the female in estrus shows up, Talamati may end up being the primary target.
PCMs are not interested in hanging with Mhangenis, but as you said, if females are in estrus, that will prob change.
RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - NLAL11 - 04-04-2025
(Yesterday, 12:03 AM)Tr1x24 Wrote:(04-03-2025, 10:29 PM)afortich Wrote: Nature is so weird, I always thought that Khanya was going to be the one not making it this long
If we look at history, more dominant/confident males are more prone to being killed, because they have more "guts" to face competition, and if they dont have backup on same lvl, they are in trouble.
Its a a thin line in between being "fearless warrior" (lets say LM Gijima for example) and being dead.
If we look some of more recent deaths, male who was more dominant in coalition died first : Nhenha, Styx, bigger S.Avoca, Guernsey, Ncile, Mandevu, K4 almost, etc.
Thats not coincidence
On the other hand, when the most dominant male does have back-up from his coalition partner(s), he is often the last one standing. Nhena is a good example of this as well, as he may have been the one to die out of his coalition with the Nkuhuma male, but he was the last surviving out of his brothers. Same with DM Majingilane and Makuhlu (Mapogo). And most dominant is not necessarily the first one to charge in. Just look at the Gijimas. DM has always been the one often seen mating with the lionesses, and while that doesn't confirm the fact completely, it does hint towards it. But his brother is always the one leading the charge.
RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - BA0701 - 04-04-2025
(9 hours ago)NLAL11 Wrote:(Yesterday, 12:03 AM)Tr1x24 Wrote:(04-03-2025, 10:29 PM)afortich Wrote: Nature is so weird, I always thought that Khanya was going to be the one not making it this long
If we look at history, more dominant/confident males are more prone to being killed, because they have more "guts" to face competition, and if they dont have backup on same lvl, they are in trouble.
Its a a thin line in between being "fearless warrior" (lets say LM Gijima for example) and being dead.
If we look some of more recent deaths, male who was more dominant in coalition died first : Nhenha, Styx, bigger S.Avoca, Guernsey, Ncile, Mandevu, K4 almost, etc.
Thats not coincidence
On the other hand, when the most dominant male does have back-up from his coalition partner(s), he is often the last one standing. Nhena is a good example of this as well, as he may have been the one to die out of his coalition with the Nkuhuma male, but he was the last surviving out of his brothers. Same with DM Majingilane and Makuhlu (Mapogo). And most dominant is not necessarily the first one to charge in. Just look at the Gijimas. DM has always been the one often seen mating with the lionesses, and while that doesn't confirm the fact completely, it does hint towards it. But his brother is always the one leading the charge.
Wasn't SN Majin the last of them to pass?
RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - Tr1x24 - 04-04-2025
(9 hours ago)BA0701 Wrote:(9 hours ago)NLAL11 Wrote:(Yesterday, 12:03 AM)Tr1x24 Wrote:(04-03-2025, 10:29 PM)afortich Wrote: Nature is so weird, I always thought that Khanya was going to be the one not making it this long
If we look at history, more dominant/confident males are more prone to being killed, because they have more "guts" to face competition, and if they dont have backup on same lvl, they are in trouble.
Its a a thin line in between being "fearless warrior" (lets say LM Gijima for example) and being dead.
If we look some of more recent deaths, male who was more dominant in coalition died first : Nhenha, Styx, bigger S.Avoca, Guernsey, Ncile, Mandevu, K4 almost, etc.
Thats not coincidence
On the other hand, when the most dominant male does have back-up from his coalition partner(s), he is often the last one standing. Nhena is a good example of this as well, as he may have been the one to die out of his coalition with the Nkuhuma male, but he was the last surviving out of his brothers. Same with DM Majingilane and Makuhlu (Mapogo). And most dominant is not necessarily the first one to charge in. Just look at the Gijimas. DM has always been the one often seen mating with the lionesses, and while that doesn't confirm the fact completely, it does hint towards it. But his brother is always the one leading the charge.
Wasn't SN Majin the last of them to pass?
No it was DM, but they all died from natural age, not in fights.
RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - NLAL11 - 04-04-2025
(9 hours ago)BA0701 Wrote:(9 hours ago)NLAL11 Wrote:(Yesterday, 12:03 AM)Tr1x24 Wrote:(04-03-2025, 10:29 PM)afortich Wrote: Nature is so weird, I always thought that Khanya was going to be the one not making it this long
If we look at history, more dominant/confident males are more prone to being killed, because they have more "guts" to face competition, and if they dont have backup on same lvl, they are in trouble.
Its a a thin line in between being "fearless warrior" (lets say LM Gijima for example) and being dead.
If we look some of more recent deaths, male who was more dominant in coalition died first : Nhenha, Styx, bigger S.Avoca, Guernsey, Ncile, Mandevu, K4 almost, etc.
Thats not coincidence
On the other hand, when the most dominant male does have back-up from his coalition partner(s), he is often the last one standing. Nhena is a good example of this as well, as he may have been the one to die out of his coalition with the Nkuhuma male, but he was the last surviving out of his brothers. Same with DM Majingilane and Makuhlu (Mapogo). And most dominant is not necessarily the first one to charge in. Just look at the Gijimas. DM has always been the one often seen mating with the lionesses, and while that doesn't confirm the fact completely, it does hint towards it. But his brother is always the one leading the charge.
Wasn't SN Majin the last of them to pass?
According to Scar's video on the Majingilanes they died about a week apart, Scar Nose and then Dark Mane. So that's what I based my assumption on, though it could be an inaccuracy.
RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - BA0701 - 04-04-2025
(8 hours ago)NLAL11 Wrote:(9 hours ago)BA0701 Wrote:(9 hours ago)NLAL11 Wrote:(Yesterday, 12:03 AM)Tr1x24 Wrote:(04-03-2025, 10:29 PM)afortich Wrote: Nature is so weird, I always thought that Khanya was going to be the one not making it this long
If we look at history, more dominant/confident males are more prone to being killed, because they have more "guts" to face competition, and if they dont have backup on same lvl, they are in trouble.
Its a a thin line in between being "fearless warrior" (lets say LM Gijima for example) and being dead.
If we look some of more recent deaths, male who was more dominant in coalition died first : Nhenha, Styx, bigger S.Avoca, Guernsey, Ncile, Mandevu, K4 almost, etc.
Thats not coincidence
On the other hand, when the most dominant male does have back-up from his coalition partner(s), he is often the last one standing. Nhena is a good example of this as well, as he may have been the one to die out of his coalition with the Nkuhuma male, but he was the last surviving out of his brothers. Same with DM Majingilane and Makuhlu (Mapogo). And most dominant is not necessarily the first one to charge in. Just look at the Gijimas. DM has always been the one often seen mating with the lionesses, and while that doesn't confirm the fact completely, it does hint towards it. But his brother is always the one leading the charge.
Wasn't SN Majin the last of them to pass?
According to Scar's video on the Majingilanes they died about a week apart, Scar Nose and then Dark Mane. So that's what I based my assumption on, though it could be an inaccuracy.
No worries, I may well be the one who is in fact incorrect, that is just what I have always believed, given their passing so near to one another. Personally, I think their passing so near to one another, after all they accomplished through their lives, is so fitting, akin to how things seem to have played out with the Ross Males, and Big Mak and PB.
RE: Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage - Tr1x24 - 04-04-2025
(9 hours ago)NLAL11 Wrote: And most dominant is not necessarily the first one to charge in. Just look at the Gijimas. DM has always been the one often seen mating with the lionesses, and while that doesn't confirm the fact completely, it does hint towards it. But his brother is always the one leading the charge.
Well theres a difference between being most dominant inside a coalition, and overall confidence and agression, which matters more when facing opponents.
LM Gijima is more agressive and confident than his brother, despite his brother being slightly more dominant over him.
Same was with Nhenha and Tinyo, and many more examples.
1 thing is fighting your well known brother in bedrooom, another thing facing unknown opponent on the streets.