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+----- Thread: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara (/topic-other-male-lion-coalitions-from-masai-mara)
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RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - KM600 - 10-08-2024
Kijana is only 5 and easily could have been chased off, him and his brother were of a similar age when they beat up two Salas boys. Anyways, going forward him and Olchore might have to try and kill a few of these boys, which sounds harsh I know but there’s just too many of them. If they were to stay around their territory, these boys will eventually overpower them with their numbers. Ironically, they’d be doing their nephews (Rongai youngsters) a favour and weakening one of their future rivals.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - Friarfan619 - 10-08-2024
(10-08-2024, 02:34 AM)adamstocks16 Wrote: @Friarfan619 The dominant male in the video is Kijana, he’s the younger brother of the famous Black Rock Males. He partnered up with Olchore, the son of Floppy Ear and Jagged Ear from Rongai Pride after his brother died and they are dominant males of Rekero Pride now.
Forgive me as I'm not an expert on mara lions but black rock = lorklup(sp?) And his bro died from disease or killed by other males?? TIA
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - LyonLover - 10-08-2024
(10-08-2024, 09:10 AM)Friarfan619 Wrote:The Black Rock Males are/were originally 5 (now only 3) males born into the Black Rock Pride around 2017-18; Olobor, Oloshipa, Oloimina, Oloisiadu & Lorkulup. Olobor & Oloisiadu are no longer around. Both more than likely killed in HWC but I think Oloisiadu’s fate is more up in the air than Olobor’s..(10-08-2024, 02:34 AM)adamstocks16 Wrote: @Friarfan619 The dominant male in the video is Kijana, he’s the younger brother of the famous Black Rock Males. He partnered up with Olchore, the son of Floppy Ear and Jagged Ear from Rongai Pride after his brother died and they are dominant males of Rekero Pride now.
Forgive me as I'm not an expert on mara lions but black rock = lorklup(sp?) And his bro died from disease or killed by other males?? TIA
They were sired by the old Black Rock Pride males known as Benna, Orkini & Longo.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - KM600 - 10-08-2024
(10-08-2024, 09:10 AM)Friarfan619 Wrote:(10-08-2024, 02:34 AM)adamstocks16 Wrote: @Friarfan619 The dominant male in the video is Kijana, he’s the younger brother of the famous Black Rock Males. He partnered up with Olchore, the son of Floppy Ear and Jagged Ear from Rongai Pride after his brother died and they are dominant males of Rekero Pride now.
Forgive me as I'm not an expert on mara lions but black rock = lorklup(sp?) And his bro died from disease or killed by other males?? TIA
Lorkulup Oloshipa Oloimina are the surviving Black Rock Boys, they have 2 brothers who died, Olobor was confirmed to be killed by herdsmen and Olosiadu was most likely killed by herdsman too as he just disappeared leaving no trace.
They had two younger brothers (Kijana and Lekijana) who followed them into Rongai Pride territory and allowed them to stick around but never join the coalition cos of their age, these boys formed a coalition with Olchore as mentioned above, after he was kicked out his natal pride from the 5 BRBs.
Lekijana also went missing without a trace (yes I know very common in Masai Mara..) but it’s impossible to know how he died as these boys were having a few confrontations with males in order to secure their own pride. It’s never been confirmed how he died and it won’t ever be, but he was a real impressive male, already fighting dominant males at the age of 3 with his brother.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - KM600 - 10-08-2024
By the way Lorkulup and Kijana were 100% sired by the same male, and I’ve heard Lorkulups father is believed to be Benna. I’ve seen photos of Benna at old age and I don’t really see it tbh but I’m guessing comparing Benna in his prime to current Lorkulup shows much more resemblance. Anyways, I’ve not seen any other males in Masai Mara, albeit I don’t follow up with them as much as other places, who have the type of mane both Lorkulup and Kijana have.
The darkness they had at such young ages on top of how thin it gets towards their back which really isn’t common for Masai Mara lions. Even down to their body types, both very tall, with the only real difference being Kijana has always been more on the bulky side whereas Lorkulup has been leaner, up until recently, with it starting to look like he’s naturally become bulkier. Definitely two of my more favourite lions in the area.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - BigLion39 - 10-11-2024
(10-06-2024, 10:26 PM)BA0701 Wrote: While I am in no way saying you are wrong, or questioning what you said, merely asking out of curiosity, as I simply have never seen such a thing happen before, certainly not with other lions. You, obviously, know way more about the happenings in the Mara than I, but, why, as @Duco Ndona also asked, would someone intentionally take a lions tail, is there some voodoo medicine value on the black market, along the lines of bear livers, etc...?
Chinese use all sorts of lion parts for their voodoo type medicine. I only speculated on that but to have 2 lions in almost the same exact area have their tails 100%, so to speak, precision removed is suspect. I know fact that criminals in Kenya enter the park on motor bikes armed with bright lights and pangas. They find lions, blind them with the lights and slash them with the pangas. This info came directly from guides in the Mara. Example; Muguro Boys Mdogo. So its not out of the realm of possibility that just to cause trouble at a minimum, filled with hate for those animals, their tails were cut off. Could be a stretch on my part but I wouldn't rule it out.
The Chinese market for lion parts is extremely big and fruitful. Had a big influence in poaching.
Pilipili and his unrelated parpartner, famous Marsh pride male Rafiki were poached in Lemek conservancy in 2020/1.... confirmed.
Green Eyes, Rekero Boy, son of Notch boys snared 2 times, I forget exactly the conservancy but I think either in MNC, Lemek, or Olarro.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - BigLion39 - 10-11-2024
(10-08-2024, 09:10 AM)Friarfan619 Wrote: Forgive me as I'm not an expert on mara lions but black rock = lorklup(sp?) And his bro died from disease or killed by other males?? TIA
The guys explained it very well. Theres 2 more sons of the old Black Rock Males, Oloiborr and Manywele sire in Oolomutia pride right before Short Tail was killed by 4 young Muguro Boys. The 3; Benna, Orkini, and Longo left for the Black Rock back in late 2016/early 2017 and he stayed back and was killed. The fight was witnessed and documented by Matira Magazine safari lodge. Anyway, they went on to sire the famous 5 BRB's and Lekijana/Kijana. Oloiborr/Manywele actually now control Black Rock Pride and also just took Sopa Pride from the remaining 2 aging Muguro Boys.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - BA0701 - 10-14-2024
Seems a very strange interaction. Not being familiar with the situation myself, and going off of the video description, apparently, Orkirikoi is now a lone male, having lost his partner a few months back, but he remains with his pride, and they have several cubs. The Mugoro boys have been in his territory for a few weeks now, and they caught him. Seems they had him on the ground, and just as they were preparing to attack him, something strange happens.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - BigLion39 - 10-18-2024
(10-14-2024, 07:46 PM)BA0701 Wrote: Seems a very strange interaction.
Yeah this was very strange behavior. Marsh Boy definately wasn't 100% comfortable as he was growling at them and on alert at a point in one of the videos I watched but rolling around and just hanging out mostly. Very strange, reminded me of 2017 when at full strength the 4 young Muguro boys did the same to Spearboy except they gave him a bad beating. Marsh boy is lucky to say the least. Sucks he lost Olbarani. They would have done great things there.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - BigLion39 - 10-18-2024
(10-06-2024, 10:26 PM)BA0701 Wrote: While I am in no way saying you are wrong, or questioning what you said, merely asking out of curiosity, as I simply have never seen such a thing happen before, certainly not with other lions. You, obviously, know way more about the happenings in the Mara than I, but, why, as @Duco Ndona also asked, would someone intentionally take a lions tail, is there some voodoo medicine value on the black market, along the lines of bear livers, etc...?
Not sure if I replied back or not as it's been a while. I'm not really sure and I'm glad you guys are questioning it. I'm simply wondering myself as 2 male lions in the same area have no tails! Hahaha! They look basically precision removed. I know the Chinese or more broadly the Asian market for lion bone and parts is fueling the huge poaching problem everywhere we have lions. So possibly tail is something they want? Maybe not and maybe it's coincidence. We mostly see half tails or missing pieces but rarely whole tail. I'm just saying the situation looks fishy. Maybe they weren't poached, maybe just sliced off with a panga.? Maybe not that at all. Maybe later on well get a better look at Kini and see if he was caught by other males?
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - adamstocks16 - 10-19-2024
A lion losing their whole tail literally makes no sense to me unless it was some kind of disease which caused it to fall off. For rival lions to target the tail specifically with the force and precision needed seems extremely unlikely and now it’s happened to two different individuals around the same area which is known for high levels of poaching activity is very suspicious.
Can’t believe we’re in 2024 and there are people who still think the bones or body parts of any animal including lions could actually be used in medicine. It absolutely blows my mind how ignorant some people are.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - Rui Ferreira - 10-19-2024
(10-19-2024, 01:06 AM)adamstocks16 Wrote: A lion losing their whole tail literally makes no sense to me unless it was some kind of disease which caused it to fall off. For rival lions to target the tail specifically with the force and precision needed seems extremely unlikely and now it’s happened to two different individuals around the same area which is known for high levels of poaching activity is very suspicious.
Can’t believe we’re in 2024 and there are people who still think the bones or body parts of any animal including lions could actually be used in medicine. It absolutely blows my mind how ignorant some people are.
If done by people, I find it hard to believe that poachers would sedate the lion and cut the tail off rather than killing the animal, glad they didnt, thank god they didnt , but weird for sure
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - BigLion39 - 10-21-2024
(10-19-2024, 04:02 AM)Rui Ferreira Wrote: If done by people, I find it hard to believe that poachers would sedate the lion and cut the tail off rather than killing the animal, glad they didnt, thank god they didnt , but weird for sure
So in the Mara there a bands of insane criminal people that ride into the park at night on motor bikes. They are armed with pangas which are basically their version of machetes and they have big bright lights. They ride up quick and shine those bright lights at the lions which disorient them. This allows them to get up close and personal which, this is my speculation, could be how a tail of a lion could be basically sliced and surgically removed. Muguro Boys Mdogo, a perfect example of a slicing by pangas. This is information shared to me by guides in the area. These people are absolutely insane and 100% HATE lions, weapons, elephants, hippos, and all the animals that they deemed trouble for them. They could care less if the harm these animals.
How else, besides infection of a lions tail and falling off over time could a lions tail be precision removed? Vet intervention could be but nothing reported. Hyena chewing off a tail that close to his body I highly, highly doubt. I've seen in videos hyenas biting down on their tails but not right onto the total end by his butt.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - Duco Ndona - 10-21-2024
I still think its a bit far fetched. Even woth a perfectly sharp knife. I doubt you would get chirurgical precision by just hacking at a unsedated lion from a motercycle.
And why just the tail?. It would be far easier and rewarding to just kill the lion and loot as much of the corpse as possible.
Its also the first time I hear of it. While more traditional ways of poaching are normally reported.
RE: Other male lion coalitions from Masai Mara - KM600 - 10-23-2024
Supposedly one of the Paradise boys, same males that were spotted in Rongai Pride territory and I think even mated with a lioness and then went into Black Rock Pride territory too, was only a matter of time before they got seriously caught. They already showed shows of injury when they went into Rongai Pride territory. I think this boy is for sure gone, it’s hard to tell how much of his back legs are either covered in blood or dirt, but he had 3 big males on him for quite some time, and until now I don’t think he’s been seen standing either. Very possible he has a broken back. Just noticed since I changed the link, u can’t see the lions named in the title unless u open it on YouTube, these are the 3 Kaskaz males.