+- WildFact (https://wildfact.com/forum)
+-- Forum: Information Section (https://wildfact.com/forum/forum-information-section)
+--- Forum: Terrestrial Wild Animals (https://wildfact.com/forum/forum-terrestrial-wild-animals)
+---- Forum: Wild Cats (https://wildfact.com/forum/forum-wild-cats)
+----- Forum: Lion (https://wildfact.com/forum/forum-lion)
+----- Thread: The Birmingham Males (/topic-the-birmingham-males)
Pages:
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
104
105
106
107
108
109
110
111
112
113
114
115
116
117
118
119
120
121
122
123
124
125
126
127
128
129
130
131
132
133
134
135
136
137
138
139
140
141
142
143
144
145
146
147
148
149
150
151
152
153
154
155
156
157
158
159
160
161
162
163
164
165
166
167
168
169
170
171
172
173
174
175
176
177
178
179
180
181
182
183
184
185
186
187
188
189
190
191
192
193
194
195
196
197
198
199
200
201
202
203
204
205
206
207
208
209
210
211
212
213
214
215
216
217
218
219
220
221
222
223
224
225
226
227
228
229
230
RE: The Birmingham Males - Mapokser - 12-08-2022
I wonder why Nhenha's instincts keep telling him to return to the West after getting chased out countless times, and he's even roaring which will only tell the PCM that it's time to chase them off again.
Is his behavior normal? Normally wouldn't a lion never return to the same territory after getting ousted?
There are prides with solo males and even the Talamati pride with no male at all, instead of risking his life in PCM territory he could be exploring. It's a shame for the Nkuhuma male as he wastes his youth in this meaningless back and forth.
RE: The Birmingham Males - sik94 - 12-08-2022
(12-08-2022, 05:29 AM)Mapokser Wrote: I wonder why Nhenha's instincts keep telling him to return to the West after getting chased out countless times, and he's even roaring which will only tell the PCM that it's time to chase them off again.
Is his behavior normal? Normally wouldn't a lion never return to the same territory after getting ousted?
There are prides with solo males and even the Talamati pride with no male at all, instead of risking his life in PCM territory he could be exploring. It's a shame for the Nkuhuma male as he wastes his youth in this meaningless back and forth.
I don't think it's just Nhena, they are both doing this together. If Nk decides to march east, Nhena will follow him. I think there's just enough room for two coalitions to squeeze in that area which is probably why the Birminghams keep going back but they need to draw the line with the PCs. If they keep running instead of showing a spine, the PCs will keep barging in and PCs are so confident because everyone gives way to them. I bet they haven't had another male's paws put on them in a while and the Birminghams need to get in a brawl with them to send a message. Or atleast chase them back after being chased.
RE: The Birmingham Males - Duco Ndona - 12-08-2022
Its probably more Nym that is calling the shots now than the aging Nhenha. Nym spend already a lot of time in Western Sector before Nhenha joined him, So he will try to stick around there.
RE: The Birmingham Males - DARK MANE - 12-08-2022
IT IS TIME.
Late tinyo passing of the guard to his son.
RE: The Birmingham Males - Mapokser - 12-08-2022
@sik94
PCM have likely killed Nhenha's cubs and have now claimed the Ximhungwe female already. There's hardly anything for them there and I think if they could fight the PCM they'd have done that before when they had 2 females and the whole West to lose. Nhenha is a smart and very experienced lion, NK is in his prime, if they didn't fought is because they understand they can't win. There's no mystery it's a 2v2 between two healthy coalitions, as we've debated already, the Birminghams' bond is likely not as strong as that of brothers, they can't risk charging without having the confidence their partner won't abandon them to their death, and despite being in great shape, Nhenha is still an old man without the energy to get in these long chases and skirmishes, and surely isn't as strong as he was in his prime.
I "blame" Nhenha because it seems he's still the most dominant of the 2 and is an old lion already with an accomplished life, I don't think a young lion such as the NK make would be willing to keep returning to the same territory when the natural behavior of young nomads is exploring in hopes of finding a good territory with females to mate.
They have amazing and easy opportunities very close to them, all they need to is to forget the West and explore a bit.
RE: The Birmingham Males - afortich - 12-08-2022
Territorial wars sometimes take 1 battle and sometimes take many battles during many months.
The fact that they keep coming back could be an indication that this is not over yet. Nhenha's condition appears to be sufficient to fight any lion and probably win.
RE: The Birmingham Males - Hairy tummy - 12-09-2022
If only the Birminghams had a map of who is where and all the information we have then they could make a calculated decision...but haven't.. They are just lions doing what lions do
RE: The Birmingham Males - Duco Ndona - 12-09-2022
We saw the same conflict adverse behaviour during the Avoca conflict so I dont think its part of a mayor master plan to take over and such.
Taking over isn't the issue. Its standing their ground is where they keep failing.
As for Nhenhas health. I think he is just getting into the I am to old for this nonsense stage of life.
RE: The Birmingham Males - Musa15 - 12-09-2022
(12-09-2022, 12:18 AM)Hairy tummy Wrote: If only the Birminghams had a map of who is where and all the information we have then they could make a calculated decision...but haven't.. They are just lions doing what lions do
lol thank you, sometimes a little common sense is needed. There isn't some master plan. Lions like any other animal are living in the moment.
RE: The Birmingham Males - afortich - 12-09-2022
(12-09-2022, 01:06 AM)Duco Ndona Wrote: We saw the same conflict adverse behaviour during the Avoca conflict so I dont think its part of a mayor master plan to take over and such.
Taking over isn't the issue. Its standing their ground is where they keep failing.
As for Nhenhas health. I think he is just getting into the I am to old for this nonsense stage of life.
I don't think there is a master plan either, they're animals. However, they have to remember that they've been chased in that sector as they would remember there is an opportunity for mating as well.
Therefore, they somehow got to be aware that there could be a fight with familiar lions.
Birminghams jerp moving west - GhostCatP-22 - 12-09-2022
(12-08-2022, 05:29 AM)Mapokser Wrote: I wonder why Nhenha's instincts keep telling him to return to the West after getting chased out countless times, and he's even roaring which will only tell the PCM that it's time to chase them off again.
Is his behavior normal? Normally wouldn't a lion never return to the same territory after getting ousted?
There are prides with solo males and even the Talamati pride with no male at all, instead of risking his life in PCM territory he could be exploring. It's a shame for the Nkuhuma male as he wastes his youth in this meaningless back and forth.
They go back west to be with Ximungwe and Gingerella. He and Nym view them as their pride and go west to visit and check on them.
He seems like he’s trying to be a good pride male and check on his girls especially with all the lion competition in the area. Nhenha has shown to be “caring” of his females.
Note I may be wrong so please let me know. Only 10% of pictures and media show up in the threads so I’m sure I missed something. Very frustrating to see a caption “wow” or “sad” and not see the picture.
RE: The Birmingham Males - Mapokser - 12-09-2022
@sik94 Sure these wars may take many battles before they finish, but in such circumstances the clashes have inconclusive results, when a male is ousted of his territory it's generally it, this is the first time I've ever see a coalition get ousted so many times and always return to the same territory.
As for fighting conditions, sure, he's in perfect shape, especially for his age, but I'd be very surprised if NK and him were able to defeat the more impressive, confident, aggressive, and united PCM.
As I said before they have much better opportunities just north of them.
RE: The Birmingham Males - Mapokser - 12-09-2022
@Hairy tummy yes they don't have a map, but let'a not pretend lions aren't adapted to figure this stuff out, roars can be heard from 8kms away ( by humans, maybe lions can hear from far than that ), they can sniff the scent mark of other lions and their instincts tell them to look around and go through multiple areas when they are nomadic, they have the tools to find new territories and assert how many males the local coalition have.
It's definitely a bit odd that they return so many times to the same place as we never see this happening with other lions so it's worth mentioning and questioning why it is happening.
RE: The Birmingham Males - afortich - 12-09-2022
(12-09-2022, 07:49 AM)Mapokser Wrote: @sik94 Sure these wars may take many battles before they finish, but in such circumstances the clashes have inconclusive results, when a male is ousted of his territory it's generally it, this is the first time I've ever see a coalition get ousted so many times and always return to the same territory.
As for fighting conditions, sure, he's in perfect shape, especially for his age, but I'd be very surprised if NK and him were able to defeat the more impressive, confident, aggressive, and united PCM.
As I said before they have much better opportunities just north of them.
The selatis were chased off by Mapogos at least twice or maybe more times before finally succeeded in ousting the Mapogos, but you're right, it appears to be odd and a rare behavior.
RE: The Birmingham Males - Duco Ndona - 12-09-2022
These arent epic battles over territories in which both sides try their best to hold on. But rather the Birminghams fleeing at the very first hint there even might be a conflict with the PCmales. Which arent even that interested in the west.
None of this behavoir can really be blamed on the other male lions. They should be able to deter them easily.
They only have themselves to blame for their current failures and if they dont get their act together, it may be better if they disapeared. As its disastrous to the local prides.