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+---- Thread: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) (/topic-all-about-gaur-bos-gaurus)
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - TigrisLeo504 - 04-28-2020
(04-28-2020, 10:56 PM)GuateGojira Wrote:(04-28-2020, 10:39 PM)TigrisLeo504 Wrote: Actually the biggest of gaurs as a species are found in Malay, Thailand places like that
I am interesting to know what is the source of that claim. I was reading the newest book about bovids of José R. Castelló (2016) and he only says that gaurs of that area (Bos gaurus laosiensis) are taller at the shoulder, but not bigger over all.
Did anyone had the source of this claim? Just checking.
I read it somewhere I forgot I'll try to find it
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - Pckts - 04-28-2020
An 800kg Gaur said to have died by old age.
https://e.vnexpress.net/news/news/gaur-dies-of-old-age-in-vietnam-nature-reserve-3957189.html
75 CM horns or 29''
*This image is copyright of its original author
I don't know where that other Gaur is, I'll need to keep looking around.
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - Rage2277 - 04-29-2020
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - GuateGojira - 04-29-2020
(04-28-2020, 11:00 PM)Pckts Wrote: I wish I could find it, but there was a Gaur from either Thailand or Vietnam that weighed 1700kg, if I'm remembering correctly.
I'll look around to see if I can find it.
Now that you mention it, I think that I remember a record for a huge gaur from "Cochin" or something like that, that weighed about that figure. Sadly I lost that information, but I also remember some measurements that according with the author where "bigger" thant those of the gaurs of India, but I never had the oportunity to compare it.
Edit: I found that in the Rowland Ward Records of Big Game of 1935 there is a report of a huge gaur that weighed 2700 lb and was reported by H. A. White from Cochin, China. This is the only record that I remember of a gaur bigger than the biggest gaur from India, based in weights at least. Here is the image:
*This image is copyright of its original author
I remember that there was a journal that discussed the realiability of the record weight of 2700 lb for that specific gaur, specially because of the fact that the record says that the gaur was "clean" in that moment, but like I told you, I lost that information.
There is other book that quote a maximum figure of 1,500 kg from China, but they do not quote any source for that claim.
This is all I can remember of that record. Nothing from Indochina, just some measurements that I had but that I was unable to compare.
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - GuateGojira - 04-29-2020
Ok, I think that I found the source of that claim. It seems that there is a book from E. C. Foenander called "Big game of Malaya: their types, distribution and habits" from 1952. Sadly I can't see the preview of the book, just fragments, but it seems that it discuss the record of 2,700 lb from Rowland Ward. Probably there is more information as this summary of the book, presented by the JBNHS Vol. 51 mentions that the discussion is in page 10 and 11, check this:
*This image is copyright of its original author
So, I guess that this is the source of the claim that gaurs of Indochina region are bigger, but I would like to see what is the conclution about that huge weight "cleaned" for the gaur.
If someone can check that book it will be perfect.
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - parvez - 04-29-2020
@Pckts You mean the 90cms horn one was only 1106kgs? I highly doubt it. May be the capacity scales were only around 1-1.2 tons. Then the one whose picture I posted must be having around 90-100cms horn. Its length then is surely beyond 11 feet. That must be a record sized specimen in every way.
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - Pckts - 04-29-2020
(04-29-2020, 04:07 AM)parvez Wrote: @Pckts You mean the 90cms horn one was only 1106kgs? I highly doubt it. May be the capacity scales were only around 1-1.2 tons. Then the one whose picture I posted must be having around 90-100cms horn. Its length then is surely beyond 11 feet. That must be a record sized specimen in every way.
Ask Guate, he's the one that found it.
It does us no good to speculate, as of now that Bull had
36" horn spread and weighed 1100kgs.
The 800kg one I just posted had 29" spread, so that seems right, but was also an old Bull that was luck enough to have died from old age so I'm sure int its prime it was over 1000kgs.
Guate
The big one I'm talking about was hit by a bus or train, I forget.
There were a couple of articles on it and pictures, I cant believe i can't find it now.
I dont know where it went.
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - GuateGojira - 04-29-2020
(04-29-2020, 04:23 AM)Pckts Wrote: Guate
The big one I'm talking about was hit by a bus or train, I forget.
There were a couple of articles on it and pictures, I cant believe i can't find it now.
I dont know where it went.
Ohhhh, no in that case is not in the old records. Take your time to found it, believe me it is going to be good for future references.
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - GuateGojira - 04-29-2020
(04-29-2020, 04:07 AM)parvez Wrote: @Pckts You mean the 90cms horn one was only 1106kgs? I highly doubt it. May be the capacity scales were only around 1-1.2 tons. Then the one whose picture I posted must be having around 90-100cms horn. Its length then is surely beyond 11 feet. That must be a record sized specimen in every way.
I had a little list of horn spread and weight related, and I can tell you that horn length and weight is not correlated based on these measurements. Check these figures from India:
a. Horn spread: 36 in - 91.4 cm -- Weight: 2438 lb - 1,106 kg.
b. Horn spread: 34 in - 86.4 cm -- Weight: 1966 lb - 891 kg.
c. Horn spread: 37 in - 94.0 cm -- Weight: 1530 lb - 694 kg.
d. Horn spread: 34 in - 86.4 cm -- Weight: 1900 lb - 861.8 kg.
e. Horn spread: 33.5 in - 85.1 cm -- Weight: 1720 lb - 780.2 kg.
f. Horn spread: 36 in - 91.4 cm -- Weight: 1700 lb - 771.1 kg.
Also remember that, according with Morris (1947) his bulls were weighed piecemeal, so there is probability that the bulls could weight a little more.
The thing is that I guess that those measurements are probably of the largest horn, as Van Ingen & Van Ingen (1945) reported a large gaur head with a horn lengths from tip to tip of 72 in (182.9 cm), the left horn was 28 in (71.1 cm) and the right horn of 27.5 in (69.8 cm). Check the picture:
*This image is copyright of its original author
Just for mere curiosity, as I don't like to collect horn or antler measurements, Nowak (1999) sais that the horn length of the gaur can be between 60 - 115 cm without quoting his sources. Schaller (1967) reported that one of the largest bulls seen at Kanha (which was killed by a tiger) was 24 inches (61 cm) and he quotes Rowland Ward (1922) when he says that the world record horn was of 31.5 in (80 cm). I checked the edition of 1914 of Rowland Ward and I saw that the longest horn measured by Mr Ward and taken outside the curve was of 34.75 in (88.3 cm), now from "owner's measurements" the longest is a horn of 40.5 in (102.9 cm). Finally, checking the book of the Maharaja of Cooch Behar (1908) recorded that the biggest horns measured 81.875 in (208 cm) from tip to tip around the external curve, the biggest horn was of 32.125 in (81.6 cm). However Rowland Ward (1914) repored an even bigger horn spread for other bull, also from the Maharaja (hunted after his book was published, probably), that measured 84 in (213.4 cm) from tip to tip, and interestingly this is not the largest bull, so probably was also not the heaviest.
So, this is the information that I found regarding horn length, weight and horn size from tip to tip.
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - parvez - 04-29-2020
@GuateGojira Yes, I too agree, body weight and horn length are not related. But we can take rough values of length of the animal with horn lengths. And based on total length we get rough estimates of weight. This was what I meant to be precise. I agree with all your data.
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - GuateGojira - 04-29-2020
Been honest, I don't know if there is going to be a correlation between horn size and body length. In fact, if you check the modern cattle, when the people want to estimate its size they use chest girth, not body length and that is the correct/normal form used to get the weight of bovines.
I provide you with information of the gaur size and horn length, if you have the time check if there is correlation between horn lengths and body length, but I think that is not.
* Cooch Behar, 1908:
*This image is copyright of its original author
* Hornaday, 1901:
*This image is copyright of its original author
* Rowland Ward, 1914 (the other gaurs not in the book of 1908):
*This image is copyright of its original author
* Morris, 1937 (only two bull heights, may be useful):
*This image is copyright of its original author
There are other body measurements (like Brander (1927) and Campbell (1842)) but do not have horn measurements, so they are not useful for you. So it seems that only the Maharaha of Cooch Behar and Hornaday took note of both (horns and body), although they did not weighed any of the bulls/cows hunted.
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - parvez - 04-29-2020
Please don't go too deep. I just based my estimates on pictures. We can scale the pictures and calculate the length based on horn length. That too only rough estimates I was saying. I too agree there isn't a relation between horn length and total length. But only we can get rough estimates of length based on horn length FROM PICTURES. That's all.
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - GuateGojira - 04-29-2020
(04-29-2020, 11:17 AM)parvez Wrote: Please don't go too deep. I just based my estimates on pictures. We can scale the pictures and calculate the length based on horn length. That too only rough estimates I was saying. I too agree there isn't a relation between horn length and total length. But only we can get rough estimates of length based on horn length FROM PICTURES. That's all.
Ok, I understand.
Just take in count that the results will be just for simple visual comparison, nothing concrete.
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - parvez - 04-29-2020
@GuateGojira glad that you didnt misunderstand. Absolutely, they are only for visual comparison, nothing concrete.
RE: All about Gaur (Bos gaurus) - parvez - 04-29-2020
Impressive gaur,
*This image is copyright of its original author
*This image is copyright of its original author
*This image is copyright of its original author