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+----- Thread: N'waswitshaka males (/topic-n-waswitshaka-males)
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RE: N'waswitshaka males - Duco Ndona - 05-29-2023
Ah. I thought you were refering to his bad leg.
I dont see the reason to be so negative about Gore.
Gore wasnt held back that much by his wound. Sure there was concerns about what would happen if it ever were ripped open in a fight. But he would still be a good assist in a fight.
A fight with him present would still be a potential fight against three lions. Which lots of lions would shy away from.
RE: N'waswitshaka males - WildRev - 05-29-2023
He also had bad legs before entering sabi sands
RE: N'waswitshaka males - Ttimemarti - 05-29-2023
(05-29-2023, 12:41 AM)WildRev Wrote:No uboso would be alive if he wasn’t attacked it was because he got attacked that he died if his back leg doesn’t get destroyed he doesn’t get “sick” the gijima males did a number on him and they didn’t catch a black dam the black dams caught amahle I love amahle but they where a more experienced coalition he might not have survived And I never said it was the end of the world for them but only 1 coalition has challenged them and that was for a reason 4 males in the area no coalition was gonna challenge them now only 2 remain it’s very likely the surrounding coalition will notice and MAYBE try to invade but I hope not(05-28-2023, 10:00 PM)Ttimemarti Wrote:How did they kill Ubuso when he lived months After the attack ? Illness killed him.(05-28-2023, 02:21 PM)WildRev Wrote: Amahle and eorenji are used too work together...there's nothing new beside the fact there no more 3 roars.
Let's not act like Ubuso and Gore were able to keep up with them when they were alive it's has always been Amahle and Eorenji who were doing most of the work.
Nothing will change.
How did they coast on numbers when 2/4 were unhealthy and that the whole coalition has always depended on the two healthy brothers ????
Nobody challenged that coalition of 4 tho only ones was the gijima males and they may or may not have lost a member when they attacked uboso and it was the gijima that basically killed uboso black dams caught amahle once I believe they said gore was present but he ran so it’s not gonna be a walk in the park for them they always had numbers but no the odds are even
Amahle was caught alone so what ?things like that happen, maybe the nwas will caught a BDM alone.
Nobody said it's gonna be a walk in the park but it's not the end of the world for them.
RE: N'waswitshaka males - Ttimemarti - 05-29-2023
(05-29-2023, 03:25 AM)WildRev Wrote:(05-29-2023, 02:03 AM)Duco Ndona Wrote: His illness is the direct result of that particular clash with the Gijimas. So they get the credit for the kill.
He was already ill when he entered sabi sands, the fight weakened him furthermore but the illness killed him, not the gijima.
Never knew he was sick before he got to sabi sands he looked fine and for awhile he was the dominant male of the 4
RE: N'waswitshaka males - sik94 - 05-29-2023
(05-29-2023, 03:54 AM)WildRev Wrote: He also had bad legs before entering sabi sands
He just had an injured front paw, the Gijima fight destroyed his back two legs which he never recovered from. He was doing just fine before that. Gore wasn't 100% at any point but he wasn't useless, he was with the other two a lot more often after Ubuso passed and was doing alright given his condition. Without those two being there, I seriously doubt if the Nw's could have taken the Kambula pride from the Bboys in a straight 2v2.
RE: N'waswitshaka males - afortich - 05-29-2023
(05-29-2023, 08:13 AM)sik94 Wrote:(05-29-2023, 03:54 AM)WildRev Wrote: He also had bad legs before entering sabi sands
He just had an injured front paw, the Gijima fight destroyed his back two legs which he never recovered from. He was doing just fine before that. Gore wasn't 100% at any point but he wasn't useless, he was with the other two a lot more often after Ubuso passed and was doing alright given his condition. Without those two being there, I seriously doubt if the Nw's could have taken the Kambula pride from the Bboys in a straight 2v2.
I completely agree with you my friend. I would also add that even when the 4 of them roar together or even the 3 of them, the message sent to intruders was stronger compared to only 2 now.
RE: N'waswitshaka males - WildRev - 05-29-2023
(05-29-2023, 05:37 AM)Ttimemarti Wrote:Sickness killed Ubuso, he had mange in his life and the black spot sickness.(05-29-2023, 12:41 AM)WildRev Wrote:No uboso would be alive if he wasn’t attacked it was because he got attacked that he died if his back leg doesn’t get destroyed he doesn’t get “sick” the gijima males did a number on him and they didn’t catch a black dam the black dams caught amahle I love amahle but they where a more experienced coalition he might not have survived And I never said it was the end of the world for them but only 1 coalition has challenged them and that was for a reason 4 males in the area no coalition was gonna challenge them now only 2 remain it’s very likely the surrounding coalition will notice and MAYBE try to invade but I hope not(05-28-2023, 10:00 PM)Ttimemarti Wrote:How did they kill Ubuso when he lived months After the attack ? Illness killed him.(05-28-2023, 02:21 PM)WildRev Wrote: Amahle and eorenji are used too work together...there's nothing new beside the fact there no more 3 roars.
Let's not act like Ubuso and Gore were able to keep up with them when they were alive it's has always been Amahle and Eorenji who were doing most of the work.
Nothing will change.
How did they coast on numbers when 2/4 were unhealthy and that the whole coalition has always depended on the two healthy brothers ????
Nobody challenged that coalition of 4 tho only ones was the gijima males and they may or may not have lost a member when they attacked uboso and it was the gijima that basically killed uboso black dams caught amahle once I believe they said gore was present but he ran so it’s not gonna be a walk in the park for them they always had numbers but no the odds are even
Amahle was caught alone so what ?things like that happen, maybe the nwas will caught a BDM alone.
Nobody said it's gonna be a walk in the park but it's not the end of the world for them.
I didn't say they catched a BDM alone I said they might do it in the futur who knows.
Any lion can die if catch alone by multiple lions, what's this argument with Amahle ? He was just at the wrong place at the wrong time and he had just scratch.
RE: N'waswitshaka males - WildRev - 05-29-2023
(05-29-2023, 08:13 AM)sik94 Wrote:He had bad back legs even before the fight, Always skinny unable to put muscle mass there, I thought it was said in this thread he had dislocated hips...there was a time where he was very skinny, like Tinyo at some point where people thought he was going to die.(05-29-2023, 03:54 AM)WildRev Wrote: He also had bad legs before entering sabi sands
He just had an injured front paw, the Gijima fight destroyed his back two legs which he never recovered from. He was doing just fine before that. Gore wasn't 100% at any point but he wasn't useless, he was with the other two a lot more often after Ubuso passed and was doing alright given his condition. Without those two being there, I seriously doubt if the Nw's could have taken the Kambula pride from the Bboys in a straight 2v2.
You can doubt that the nwas could have taken the kambula pride but I doubt they couldn't have, Nhenha was in top form, not Tinyo but all of this are ''if''
RE: N'waswitshaka males - Mapokser - 05-29-2023
The Ndhzenga underestimation IMO goes all the way back to the size discussions. Regardless of the relevance of size, people have in their subconscious the comments from rangers and the such saying Ndhzengas are small, hence they think they won't be formidable in an even 2v2 clash, if they weren't considered small I doubt anyone would underestimate a brotherly duo of prime males in a reserve where currently every dominant male is either alone or in a duo.
Like look at the comments above someone doubted they could have ousted Bboys 2v2 despite in theory the aging Bboys would have a disadvantage against prime and also dominant Ndhzengas.
Again, this is just my take, I might be wrong.
RE: N'waswitshaka males - afortich - 05-29-2023
Personally, I never underestimate these boys because the lion size is not the only factor to win a fight.
Just to clarify, my comment above has to do with the reduction on coalition members that obviously expose them to be defeated if/when facing another confident coalition that outnumbers them, which is the same issue facing any other dominant coalition when is outnumbered regardless the physical characteristics of each lion (size, weight, etc.).
RE: N'waswitshaka males - Tr1x24 - 05-30-2023
(05-29-2023, 09:52 PM)Mapokser Wrote: The Ndhzenga underestimation IMO goes all the way back to the size discussions. Regardless of the relevance of size, people have in their subconscious the comments from rangers and the such saying Ndhzengas are small, hence they think they will no be formidable in a even 2v2 clash, if they weren't considered small I doubt anyone would underestimate a brotherly duo of prime males in a reserve where currently every dominant male is either alone or in a duo.
Like look at the comments above someone doubted they could have ousted Bboys 2v2 despite in theory the ageing Bboys would have a disadvantage against prime and also dominant Ndhzengas.
Again, this is just my take, I might be wrong.
That size thing was mainly pointed towards OE male, while people immidiately started saying that all Ndhzengas are small, while other 3 are average sized males.
For example, i dont think Amahle is visiable/noticable smaller then any other males in Sabi Sands except PC males.
And in the end size doesnt matter that much.
(05-29-2023, 08:13 AM)sik94 Wrote: Without those two being there, I seriously doubt if the Nw's could have taken the Kambula pride from the Bboys in a straight 2v2.
Nhenha and weak Tinyo in 2021 struggled against Mohawk and unhealthy/limping Blondie, i seriously doubt that Nhenha and Tinyo could do anything against prime Amahle and OE in late 2021, given Tinyo state at that time.
If Ndhzengas didnt come, Nhenha and Tinyo would lose territory to Mohawk and Blondie in 2vs2 shortly after, as Tinyo was very weak.
So yea, quite sure that Amahle and OE would beat them, and fairly easly i think.
RE: N'waswitshaka males - Mapokser - 05-30-2023
@Tr1x24 A Londolozi ranger did say Amahle wasn't much smaller than Nhenha and PCM so there's that, but others who have seen them in person too have said all were small.
But anyway I agree that in a clash size probably won't be a big factor especially because they often don't even fight but rather chase each other.
RE: N'waswitshaka males - WildRev - 05-30-2023
Sean Zeederberg said that amahle is enormous when he saw Gore and him for the first time patrolling londolozi
RE: N'waswitshaka males - WildRev - 06-01-2023
RE: N'waswitshaka males - WildRev - 06-04-2023
we were very happy to find the two remaining brothers of the N’waswitshaka coalition on our piece of land