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+--- Thread: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? (/topic-behind-the-big-cat-s-and-bear-s-who-is-the-top-predator)
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - Pantherinae - 11-05-2015
(11-05-2015, 05:10 AM)Pckts Wrote: You're not putting that big boy in throat hold, thats a hamstring attack for sure.
haha that's true, he's not gonna get a quick death if caught by a pride of lions( even worse with on or two lions). testicles and hamstring as you said is going to be attacked!
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - Dr Panthera - 11-05-2015
(11-05-2015, 05:06 AM)Pckts Wrote: The scat analysis doesn't determine if the prey was killed or scavenged so its a bit less complete IMO.
I look at Sambar for Tigers the way Wildabeest and Zebra are important for lions.
I think both are extremely dependent on those particular animals.
We can rule out the possibility of scavenged meals for sure.
An adult sambar for a tiger or an adult wildebeest for a lion is an ideal meal...relatively large ( 150 kg for the smallest female and 270 kg for a large male) so a week worth of food for a tiger or a solitary lion, relatively available in prime tiger and lion habitat, and relatively easily killed with less of a chance of injury ..
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - GrizzlyClaws - 11-05-2015
@Pantherinae, holding the throat would require much less energy, see how Raja had easily managed to subdue a 1200 lbs female gaur.
This old male lion was also trying to hold the throat against the female cape buffalo, but he was just too old to perform that.
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - Pantherinae - 11-05-2015
yeah I know, but on a larger Gaur the throat grip would be much harder and the tiger would have to put up a much better fight, the gaur Raja kills is not 1200 lbs, when Raja kills larger gaurs (he looks like a specialist on gaur's) he needs to wear the massive beast, but anyways here is Renoka a large male lion when he kills a large buffalo cow, if he was trying on a bull he might have had to fight for 24 hours.
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - GrizzlyClaws - 11-05-2015
This is a very powerful male lion, and his brute strength is quite comparable to that of Raja.
I do agree to bring down a bull requires much more effort.
Still, this male lion has more impressive kill than many other male lions, perhaps mostly due his strength and also due his larger canines perhaps.
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - Pantherinae - 11-05-2015
(11-05-2015, 06:38 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote: This is a very powerful male lion, and his brute strength is quite comparable to that of Raja.
I do agree to bring down a bull requires much more effort.
Still, this male lion has more impressive kill than many other male lions, perhaps mostly due his strength and also due his larger canines perhaps.
Renoka is an incredibly large male lion at least framing wise, yeah looks a lot like the raja's hunt. never seen his canines though.
bulls are such powerful and impressive animals I would bet a healthy bull would win 50% of conflicts between big cats!
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - Sully - 11-05-2015
(11-05-2015, 05:06 AM)Pantherinae Wrote:(11-05-2015, 04:34 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote: The clouded leopards have the longest fangs by proportion, but they are also very thin and lightly built.
Unlike the jaguars, the lions don't have proportionally short fangs, they also used it to pierce against the big preys.
The lions with longer fangs also require less effort to kill the big preys. For example, Cecil has applied an instant killing bite against the elephant calf, while his blood brother Jericho was merely assisting him to pin the calf on the ground.
The lion with longer fangs would also use the same tactic as tiger, just to finish off the prey as quick as possible, not spending too much time to chew off the back and spine.
yeah it's true, but to strangle a cape buffalo bull seems impossible without wearing the animal out by chewing on the spine and back. and also often the lions needs to injure the buffalo because the heard will come back to defend the attacked buffalo. and the hunt for buffalo can take hour's so the lions will often just injure the animal so badly it can't keep up and at the end falls victim for the hungry cats.
look at this bull in this video that I saw yesterday, this is gotta be the most impressive neck I have ever seen on a wild bovine I'm shocked!
the massive bull appears at 00:30
Wow, that is one of the most impressive bovines I have ever seen! Packed full of muscle, a real butch specimen there, would hate to be any lion on the wrong end of that fella. Thank for sharing.
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - GrizzlyClaws - 11-05-2015
The female buffalo had quickly collapsed on the ground which implied that her windpipe was instantly crushed.
In most of time, the female buffalo can still stand on the ground for a long while with the snout or throat getting suffocated by other smaller male lions.
Renoka is an impressive male with overwhelming strength, also perhaps with the tiger-like fangs.
I've seen this video before, and this hunt is indeed one of my favorite among the big cats' kills.
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - Pantherinae - 11-05-2015
@GrizzlyClaws yeah Renoka is an impressive male for sure has some impressive shoulders.
*This image is copyright of its original author
Here is a picture of him
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - GrizzlyClaws - 11-05-2015
He is getting aged in that pic, and the canines also seem to be worn down.
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - Pantherinae - 11-05-2015
(11-05-2015, 07:13 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote: He is getting aged in that pic, and the canines also seem to be worn down.
yeah seems like this was taken about at the end of his prime.
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - GrizzlyClaws - 11-05-2015
Feel bad for him that one day he might get harassed by the punk males like these.
They are nowhere good hunters, yet they would be sneaky enough to take the advantage on a weakened old king.
At the end of the reign of a dominant male lion, he would usually get overthrown by a coalition of the smaller male lions.
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - brotherbear - 05-02-2016
(05-28-2015, 08:19 AM)Pantherinae Wrote: wanna discuss which carnivorus mammal on land whio's the most impressive after the 3 biggest cat's (lion, tiger and jaguar)
and all bears (except the sun bear)? let me hear you're opinions
obvious contenders are
-leopard
-cougar
-wolf
-spotted hyena
I wouldn't dismiss the little sun bear so easily. Pound for pound he is a pretty tough fighter. For his size he has the longest canines and the longest wickedly-curved claws of any living bear. He has loose skin which makes it difficult for a adversary to get a good grip with his teeth. In past times, the Chinese Shar Pei was bred as a fighting dog with this quality in mind. For a bear, he has an impressive bite-force. This smallest of living bears is nothing to play with.
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - Ba Ba Lou - 11-30-2016
(06-06-2015, 04:43 PM)Pantherinae Wrote: a little silly comment @faess, such kind of comments will lead to heated debates, but what a great picture TFS.
but to answer. don't you think a leopard would kill a wolf? there are actually pictures of a leopard who has battled down a quite big hyena.
a single hyena is a much harder apponent than a lone wolf,
*This image is copyright of its original author
Cougar need to step it up.
RE: behind the big cat's and bear's, who is the top predator? - Ba Ba Lou - 11-30-2016
Pantherinae, the leopard apparently killing a hyena, my question was the attack a frontal attack, surprise attack or a sneak attack from behind ?